Visitor Feedback Book 1!

From: Liane Blackburn
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Windows

I took Pacesetter four months to install my windows. I don't know how many installers they went through to get this job done but there were a few. Before they finished the job I was already asking Mr. Alan Kanngieser to just remove the windows and I will just get my windows from some where else. (I was ready to put up plywood)But he convinced my husband to let them finish the job and then we would negogiate the price. My husband did get a 40% discount but it hasn't been worth it. I now have a cracked window that they will not come and fix. I thought the warranty was for the whole window not just the hardware.

I wish that I took them to court instead of settling for a discounted price.

From: C.P.
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter is misleading

As you well know, Pacesetter was bought by Gary Iskra and outsourced the products through Republic Window. They advertise on the basis of the original Pacesetter Products when indeed they are the products of Republic Window. A person believing they are getting the great products we used to make will be greatly disappointed in the products that now have the Pacesetter name on them. I see they now have commercials with Bob Eubanks promoting Pacesetter. I wonder if Bob knows that 80+ workers with an average of 30 years with the company were kicked to the curb due to his outsourcing to Republic Window and busted the union and closed down all Omaha operations. He didn't even have the decency to give us the news in person, we never even got to lay eyes on him in those last days. I myself when purchasing any home improvment products will research and make sure that nothing is coming from The likes of Republic Window or Gary Iskras Pacesetter. I urge all union members to boycott Pacesetter Products (which are being pushed throught Sam's Club and K-Marts) In respect of all of us Union Members Of USWA 5427 who lost our jobs. Thank you!

From: Suzi McMullen
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Where are the stories???

Hello,
I found this website while I was trying to do some research on Pacesetter corporation. One of your pages said something about a way to share these stories without getting into trouble. Can I find them? So far all I see is remarks about the stories being taken down.

Suzi

Admin's Response: Ah, it seems as if Google changed the links to some of the newsgroup posts. I have just finished finding and fixing the links for the stories which were not showing up, so you should be able to see them all once again.

From: Ben Johnson
E-Mail: Private
Subject: close call

I was recently hired to be a canvasser for the Pacesetter Corp.; and after finding this site I'm calling in sick today and as of tomorrow I will not work for them anymore!!

From: Rosanne Schiedel
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Replacement windows

After we informed these sellers we already had told them there would be no deals made until our main project was completed, they called again. Set another appointment, we told them again no deal we have other priorities, they called again. Tell me please, what word will make them stop. No doesn't work.

From: Justin Thompson
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Looking for windows, won't use Pacesetter.

Thanks for the website! With all the negative feedback on Pacesetter, I'm not going to be using them for my new home windows!

From: Tricia
E-Mail: Private
Subject: just got call

My babysitter received a call at my home today from these Pacesetter people saying they had an apointment with me, to do some window work on my house when they asked him if I owned my my he said no they then asked him for my drivers license number which he didnt know thank goodness. But my question is are these the same people who ran the Pacesetters company out at the Old Castle Air Force Base between Atwater and Merced, because they left under some kind of money scandal too, it sounds like the same people. Can I report this to some one before they strike again?

From: AL Gallagher
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter

After reading your website about Pacesetter, I concluded that you are not referring to Pacesetter Mortgage Company in Okemos, Michigan but rather to a home improvement business. Is that correct?
I'm not personnaly involved with either company but I was looking for information on Pacesetter Mortgage and your website was one that was found by the search engine.
If you are not referring to Pacesetter Mortgage perhaps it would be helpful to clearly provide the name of the business you are referring to so there isn't any confusion.
Thanks.

Admin's Response: We are referring to the Pacesetter Corporation which sells and installs home improvement products (they also used to make the products). This is very clearly stated in the second paragraph on the main page of the site. We also try to reference them as "Pacesetter Corp." whenever possible.

From: Rosanne Schiedel
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Windows

What should we say to get rid of these circling sharks? We had them give us an estimate, and told them we have another huge renovation underway and that would have to be completed first. They keep calling! They actually are scarey in that they keep saying "please invite them in to talk" we will beat that price etc. Do you have "the word" or "words" we can use to make them absolutely stop calling? They seem to be setting us up for burglary

Admin's Response: The next time they call, tell them to put you on their Do Not Call list. That should work, because if they call after your number is on their Do Not Call list, then the company can be fined, and from what I've heard they're hurting for money nowadays.

From: Denise Lewis
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Cabinet Refacing and Windows

I had an appointment with the Pacesetter Corp in August 2004. Like you said they had all the bells and whistles. I signed a contract for kitchen and bathroom cabinet refacing as well as new windows.

I live in a condo so I gave the sales associate all the paperwork that needed to be done to satisfy the association and he assured me that they go through them all the time.

They said that it would be 2-3 weeks. On the last day of the third week I called them. They never called me! About the fifth week a guy came out to reface my cabinets. He was supposed to be there at 9:00 am and didn't get there till noon. And only one guy! He told me that he used to reface cabinets but hadn't done it in awhile, that gave me a warm fuzzy! The job was supposed to be done in 1 day. He was there for about 3, I say about as he came from Corona and didn't get there till noon each day.

I was missing one cabinet door,pantry door and 2 other cabinet doors were wrong and of course the handles for the doors were not in. The guy wanted me to sign a completion letter stating that if I didn't he would not get paid!
I felt bad for him but explained that I couldn't sign for something that was not finished.

Still no windows and this is 5 weeks later. The cabinets were finished in October almost 2 months later.

The windows finally came in November after several calls from me, none from them. A board member of the Association happened by (thank goodness)he stated that no windows had been approved in over 3 months. I called my Sales Associate as well as the installation people who said they didn't know anything about the association.

I sent the windows away and was furious! Unfortunately the contract I had signed did not have individual breakdowns of the refacing or windows, it was all lumped together.

They tried to charge me $9000.00 for the refacing and finally I settled on $6000.00 still high I believe now.

The reason that I am writing this today is I noticed that one of my cabinet doors(the one that was missing) is shorter than the rest. You have to be looking from the living room area to notice, but it is almost 2" shorter.

I looked on the internet to get Pacesetters phone# and ran across your site. I wish I had seen this sooner. Now I hope they replace my cabinet door, but if not I haven't completely paid yet so I do have somne recourse.

Sincerely,
Denise Lewis

From: John Allison
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter.

I worked for the Pacesetter company, I now regret doing so. After seeing your site I realize what people I really worked for. They were even unrealistic with our goals to meet as "pushers" as I like to call it. What we did was stand around a warehouse store (not to be named) and try to push their products on unsuspecting people. Now i see this site, and they told us specifically not to go here, and wish I never signed on with them. I quit a while ago. Hallejuah for that.

From: KEVIN TURNER
E-Mail: Private
Subject: PACESETTER

I DO APPRECIATE YOU TAKING THE TIME TO INFORM OTHERS OF

YOUR DEALINGS WITH PACESETTER. I WILL NOT USE THIS COMPANY

FOR MY PROJECTS. THAT IS THE KIND OF REPUTATION THAT WILL

SAY ALOT TO THE CONSUMERS, AND WE DO LISTEN.

From: Dan Tintinger
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter Corp.

My experience with Pacesetter was around the beginning of 2004, My wife and I had ordered windows and a slider for our home and waiter for the delivery date to come up, they were only a couple of days late so I didn't sweat it at the time. The installers showed up and proceeded to install our new windows. It took them 3 days to install 7 windows and the slider, and all they did was remove the slider part of the windows and leave the frame from the old windows in as they said that they couldn't remove them because of the vapor seal. I said I had never heard of it and he said the law had just been passed in January of this year. They had to dig out some of the window sills on some of the window for some unknown reason and use lots of caulk. All I know is I lost all of my window sills ( I only had about 3/4 to 1 inch left) (my cats weren't very happy about that) anyway I complained to Pacesetter about the problem and called the manager at the time I think Todd was his name. I told them I wasn't going to make any payments until the windows were done to my satisfaction. They also said they were going to give us a new storm door on our fromt door (they acually did this one right) They finally sent over a couple of workers named Steve and Cheryl. These are the most wonderful people I have ever had the pleasure of meeting, not only did they remove all of our windows and old frames and reset them right they replaced the damaged sills and put up moulding around the outside of the windows (this couple are now very good friends, they don't work for Pacesetter anymore) My biggest problem was the initial installation, but because of Steve and Cheryl the "Pacesetter Experience" wasn't as bad as your. But I have heard a bunch of horror stories from them about other peoples "Pacesetter Experiences" I only hope that other people have had the pleasure of meeting Steve and Cheryl. P.S. the installer that originally installed our windows was fired. I hope this helps some as our experiance wasn't as bad as some of them out there.
Dan & Val

From: Samantha Jones
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetters

Hi,

I just wanted you to know that Pacesetters is now using a manufacturer by the name of Republic in Chicago. Perhaps you can link their website to this site. Because I know Republic windows suck big time.
www.republicwindows.com
Thank you,
Sanm

From: Neil
E-Mail: Private
Subject: thanks

Wow, I was about to consider an interview with them for employment. Did you ever save me a headache, thanks

From: J
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter siding

As you may know, Pacesetter continually sets the bar for low business standards. As a follow-up to my other story, my friend's siding that blew off was never fixed by Pacesetter. He won an $8,000.00 settlement from them in court, despite what the local rep told me. The local Pacesetter rep told me that the case was thrown out. Apparently they're tained well to lie without hesitation to anyone.

From: PriVaTE
E-Mail: Private
Subject: PaceseTTer The GreaT

Well I am writing because I was told about this website by one of my clients above all else, yes, I am a Pacesetter employee and a pretty good one at "selling the dream". I am a recently employeed sales rep who has just been promoted as of a month ago and I have heard and seen it all. I have heard and seen alot of this things happen before my vary own eyes, and I hate to see it happen so that is the reason why I write and why I am looking into either a new company, or a new career in sales because I seem to be really good at it.I know for a fact that we are one of the most expensive home improvement companies there is period. But the company as has been said before does pay it's sales rep's alot in commissions, we have trips to Cabo San Lucas, bonus' and a real easy shot at making that six figure income, but none of it worth it when i see what we do and I have to hear this from people who put their trust in me thousands of dollars at a time. The problem is not the product or the price because it is very high quality products that we use and resonable prices for what you get............. when you do eventually get it if done right, but what takes place after that and on the inside. Working for the company are some of the shadiest and most moronic people known to mankind. The management is all under qualified and the installation department is full of some of the most inexperienced, unprofesional bunch of people you will ever come in contact with. Just because a person can "sell a dream", or BS for 3 hours at a time doesn't mean that they should run an office or lead a group of individuals. Just make sure that you know what your getting yourself into, and if you do go with them, they can give you an extra 5% off of their list price, more if they padded it plus rebates good not only on initial day of demenstration like they say, but anytime plus up to another 20% if their having a sell. ;-}

From: butch419
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Got and idea

Listen i just left you an email and if i came across rude i didnt mean too, but,if i say anything i could lose my job and i cant afford that. I consider myself one of the best Siding installers in the worl because i have seen the crap that most do, i could open up and whole new book against pacesetter, and i am talking about so much info that a lawyer could see it and say,thats their ass. I rlly dont care about my name getting out, they cant do nothing to me, but my job is important to me and my family and thats how we survive so unless i find another job that pays this good well i have to keep my mouth shut.

From: Butch419
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Hmmmmmmm

I work for pace setter and i know what your talking about in your stories, pacesetter pays me you dont so i cant rlly say anything but besides you read contract why did you sign it? Did you not check everything out before hand?

From: James Mastin
E-Mail: Private
Subject: PaceSetter sure does Suck

At this time we have an Eight Thousand Dollare ($8000.00)
Judgement awarded to us from Small Claims court in Rapid City SD.

We paid over Twelve Thousand Dollars ($12000.00) in the form of a check, Paid in Full at completion of instalation of siding, which within months Blew off our house.

Even with a Judgement awarded by Court they won't pay.

From: exemployee
E-Mail: Private
Subject: there going under

as of the first of the year.i know there indy,ohio,nashville,offices are closed.

From: exemployee
E-Mail: Private
Subject: you aint even close to all the crimes they have comited against god and country

I worked for them for 10 years or better.seen them charge 35,000 for 9sq.siding,20%interest,7000% for leaf guard.

From: Heather
E-Mail: Private
Subject: I worked for Pacesetter

I worked for Pacesetter, And I was a telemarketer,than transfered to a receptionist/ in control of the reps and there feedback from their leads, and i gotta say the only thing that was really bad is that their was 2 females working there that got to basically get away with not working and get paid for it,As wel has hang all over the manager that was in charge of the seattle/Tacoma office, It was a hostile inviroment for a lot of people I witnessed argurments and huge meetings over the unfairness of the company. Than to top things off the senior vise president came down with any notice to tell us they we closing the office down and we all were out of jobs except those they chose to keep and either work from home or go to Sacremento California and the rest of us were basically screwed, especially those who have children like myself it was hard to find a job But I did and I enjoy my new job they are not foney they are a real company, not saying that [paceseter is foney, just saying there are some out there that are!! Anways this is a very dissapointed ex-employer

From: Ralph & Patti Lyman
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Texture Coat

We were "rushed" into the sale, they inspected it at night,

and since then we have been trying to get them to come &

see it. (This was in April 04.) They textured over bad

masonite, (the worker was nice & worked hard...But we still

felt HE was "rushed" also. I get no response when I email

them. Maybe I'll try complaining over the phone. I don't

want to get a lawyer, but I'm willing to writh the Better

Business Bureau. Patti Lyman

From: j.h.
E-Mail: Private
Subject:

Er, actually it was 7 windows....but still... $1,000.00 a window? Come on!

From: Justin Hager
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter Promises/Financing and other wonderful BS

I have my very own story for you folks. I was receiving phone calls from Pacesetter just about every day, waking me up (I work at night), and let my answering machine pick up the call. One morning, for some unknown reason, I actually picked up the phone. I sleepily agreed to meet a sales rep for my windows, because I actually do need new ones.

I met with the rep, and got the entire pep talk/BS lines, etc as described here on your site. I had no idea I was in for such a treat. I hastily agreed to the price and financing that Pacesetter gave me, and went to work. When I got to work, I was telling the folks here about my recent purchase agreement, and was informed that Pacesetter was a rip-off. That night, I went home and filled out the cancellation form. I had no idea how much that saved me 'till I visited here.

Today I got a call from that rep from Pacesetter asking me why I cancelled. I told him that a guy from work has a pending case against them (which he does), and that I don't want to get swindled. After saying all of that, I got a hold of their manager, and he assured me that the guy I work with was in the wrong (which I know he's not; I've worked with the guy for 3 years) and that I shouldn't worry about anything.

Now here comes the interesting part. After I mentioned all that, I got this sap story about how business is low at the moment, and that I could get a great deal ($7,000 for 5 windows is a great deal?), and that he could knock off about $1,500 off the original invoice price that was quoted to me earlier; plus he could get me a free storm door on top of it all. Sounds great, right? When he started saying things like that, it seemed as though he was really getting desperate for the sale, and to my knowledge, big corporations don't get desperate over 5 windows. Whatever happened to honesty and business ethics?

From: john thompson
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter at it again

After working for pacesetter for almost 10 years I was laid off last year in Dec, only to be called back a few months later. Then laid off again just before christmas this year. This company doesn't care about anyone. My advice is don't do business or work for them unless you like to be be lied to and treated like crap.
As for the message about everyone getting kick backs for selling the products that is not true. The actually rep gets commision on their sales and management has a chance to bonus on a monthly basis. Most the time they find a way not to pay your bonus by holding jobs out of production and many other ways the upper management are pros at keeping you from make your quota to bonus.
Most of the top corprate people left over the last year. The company just got done laying off somewhere near 250 people just this month. The products are no longer built by pacesetter as they shut down the factory about a year ago(who cares about the factory workers that had been there for around 30 years). The retail part of the company was bought out about 2 years ago and the named was changed from pacesetter corparaton to pacesetter corparation of america. Since then everything went to hell. One week they would say hire and train 4 people this week then the next week they would say we are pulling out of that area fire the people you just hired.

I only wish I didn't waste 10years of my life working for such a shitty company that would lie to you everytime they said anything. I never understood why anyone would buy from them as the prices about 2x what they should be. IMO you would have to be almost brain dead to do a deal with them.

STAY AWAY FROM PACESETTER AT ALL COST!! THE COMPANY WILL MOST LIKELY BE SHUT DOWN BY THIS TIME NEXT YEAR!!!
MERRY CHRISTMAS (not to me as my christmass bonus two years in a row was being laid off, I must be dumber then the people that bought from them accept my job back after the first lay off)

Admin's Response: For those of you who don't know, "IMO" is internet chat lingo for "In My Opinion".

From: joel hall
E-Mail: Private
Subject: p sucks

i do notary legal mtg signings and a co called a lady will asssist called to hire my services to notarize and witness a mortgage for pacesetter. I gave them a deal thinking I would get more business from them. I never got paid, I called pacesetter to try to ask them and I can't get an answer back from either of them . It's simple, don't do business with either of them. call me if you wish. I traveled 220 miles for them for my local fee, the least they can do is talk to me I'm in the upper part of mi.

From: Kelly
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Gluttons

WE are Gluttons for punishment!!! We have had windows installed cabinets refaced, wood blinds and an upgraded screen room done all by Pace setter, and Shisty shisty shisty is all I can say. We kept thinking they would get it/ Make it right.

I just finished reading numerous emails regarding these guys. And everything stated we have also experienced.

1. Hard pressure sell
2. Very over priced
3. Trick you into thinking your getting "something"thrown in since your spending so much money.
4. Hold second on your house.
5. Shody work
6. Never show up when they say they will.
7. Break things at your house (Broke out side lighting did not tell us we had to find it and call them to make them come back to fix it)
8. Call to get you to pay for work not done or even attempted to be done.
9. Call to get a customer feed back on the quality and timelyness of their work .... BAD MOVE. I let them know how bad the work is
10. I actually had our sales man show up and just walk in my house univited!
11. FREQUENT CALLs made to request work be finished or fixed. Promises to return calls. Promises to fix situation. Very very very lax response if any. The only reason our items were fixed is because my husband was a bulldog with them.

Anyway as one woman put it "We were so dumb" but not really you figure people will be ethical. I tend to trust people to much. I trust there are people out there that are honest and eithical. .. However PACE Setter is not amoung them. I am glad I ran into this page. I feel better knowing we are not the only persons who has had a less the favorable expereince. Sorry there have been so many but misery loves company.

From: Tim Olivera
E-Mail: Private
Subject: The Pacesetter Sweepstakes

I saw a commercial Oct 22, 2004 for door's and windows or exter siding or $25,000 cash so I call the 1-800 number and tell them sign me up for the windows and doors. The lady asks if a rep can call me and come out and show me what they have. So I say what the heck why not. An appointment was setup for Nov 15, 2004 1:00pm. I take thw 1/2 day off work and set around home waiting for the guy. He never shows up!! OnNov 17, 200 at 5:54pm I get another call and an excuse, another appointment is setup for Nov 26, 2004 2:00pm. I get home from work at 12:30 and set around the rest of the day, agian no one shows up.. SO I go out on the net and type "Pacesetter Corp" into Google and hit enter. Wowya I see PacesetterSucks.com and wonder "what the heck??" after reading a few of the complaints on your page I'm glad they didn't showup, after all it only cost me a days work not tens of thousnds of dollars like you folks have had to shell out. Thanks for the heads up!!

Tim Olivera

From: robert stock
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Sams Club

If you really want to hurt pace setter get sam club to kick their appointment setters out of their stores.

From: Charlie Row
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Saved a possible mistake!

Thanks a million for a great website. They are running an add in the Baltimore Sun classifieds for THE PERFECT SALES OPPORTUNITY. I always try to check a company out on the internet and THANK GOD for all of your info. It just might have saved me from making a big mistake. Keep up the good work and KEEP FIGHTING for the little guy.
Thanks again,
Charlie Row

From: Vince
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter calls

do you have more phone calls on Pacesetter telephone reps?

Admin's Response: The two that we have posted on the site are the only two we have.

From: anthony mcnulty
E-Mail: Private
Subject: I am a happy customer, will you post this?

Hey folks I read some of your remarks and stories and while I am not saying that they are wrong I am saying that yuou must be suspect of some of these postings as coming from local contractors losing out on th business. I have had some nightmare experiences with locals and have not had any recourse as they have all gone out of business only to open up in another name at a later date. I chose Pacestter because they have been in business so long, 42 years I believe and they obviously do make some mistakes , however I had a door and some windows installed and I am entirely happy with the experience and will reccomend tham to friends and family. I understand that this site is for bad news about the comppany but how about putting this up to let the truth be told. ALL COMPANIES HAVE PROBLEMS, however NOT ALL COMPANIES WILL TRY TO RESOLVE THEM. Pacestter remains in business in spite of this site and my BBB has no record of complaints in my area. You decide what that means.

sincerly

anthony

Admin's Response: Will we post this? I'm not sure what other meaning "this form will submit your message to us, as well as post it on the website" could possible have. Or did just you not take the time to read the statement directly above the feedback form?

Anyway, yes, all companies have problems, and not all companies will try to resolve them. And in our experience, Pacesetter is one of those companies that will not try to resolve them. It's true that they have been in business for a long time, and from what were told it used to be a great company, but they did just recently close down their manufacturing plant which seems to indicate they're not doing so well anymore, even with their super inflated prices.

From: Pam Lewiston
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Closed down, huh?

MThank you for voicing what I have been privately fuming over for these past few years. I have just learned that Pacesetter violated the setback regulations for our property when they installed our enclosed patio (which took over a year for them to do...don't ask) even though they assured us that they would not have to pull a permit in order to do the installation. I was young and dumb then and assumed they knew what they were talking about. I read your post about them closing down and I see that their website is still functioning - I wonder who I can sue?

From: aat griff
E-Mail: Private
Subject: response to Steve k

Your inability to even spell correctly is a very good indication why you have worked for this Company for twelve years.
Why don't you post a new comment about the bonus you recieve for going on this site and saying such "sweet things" about this unscupulous bunch of human wannabees? Oh, and nice touch with the Irish blessing. You shame all true Irishman.

From: anthony griffin
E-Mail: Private
Subject: working for free.

I trusted that if you take a job and work,,,,,,that you would get payed. For three months I ran all over West virginia, Maryland and Ohio to see customers for the pacesetter co,,and was told several weeks in a row that I had no pay coming to me. When I was dismissed from the company, I was actually relieved, because I could not afford to work for them anymore) AND I left nine different jobs undone.I have been told for weeks now that those jobs all fell through.What a bunch of crap. Since I was employed for them I have seen many ads to hire new employees at this same office. It seems to me, they get trusting people, especially young ones, and promise them six figure incomes. These new hires then wear out their cars and "weed out" the bad customer leads.Then the three senior employees (the only ones that have been employed continually since the office opened, then go and close the old, weak, ignorant and all the easy touches. They proudly call these people "MOOCHES". THIS SHOULD HAVE TOLD ME ABOUT THE LACK OF RESPECT THEY HAVE FOR THEIR CUSTOMERS AND EVEN THEIR EMPLOYEES. NORTH CENTRAL WEST VIRGINIA BEWARE OF THESE DECEITFUL AND TOTALLY DISHONEST PEOPLE. I have been in sales for twenty years, this is not sour grapes ! To anyone that I may have sold PACESETTER products to, I apologize very much. However I have been victimized also.

From: goodwillmom
E-Mail: Private
Subject: full mortgage lien on our home

Attention: Pacesetter defrauded us 10-26-04

On 3-31-03 two guys came to our home and I feel like we were swindled.
Let me set the scene for you, two guys came to our door selling windows. They acted like the cops from Mayberry RFD show, the one was the nice guy like Andy Taylor and the other acted like Barney Fife, the dumb fumbling idiot. During the show they put on, the one guy would act like he had to help the other guy because he was new. He would help him fill out the papers and distract us from our question we had of them. They acted as if they were our long lost friends; they went as far as inviting themselves to my daughter graduation party. They were at our house for hours talking about everything but the windows or a lien!

I recently looked over the contract with them, they have the cover sheet which I believe is different then what the yellow copy we received (the buyer’s copy). I sent them a letter asking to see the original but got the letter back marked (Not Deliverable As Addressed Unable To Forward)

What we thought we were signing is the agreement for the finance charges. He held his hand over most of the papers and just said sign here. After the two days of conning us we were worn down and did what he said. You can see where we wrote our initials, we were just signing for finance charge payments.

Now this was a couple day processes they played us like a fine instrument.
When all was done we owed $ 12,705.60 dollars. That is fine, but what we were not told at anytime was the fact that we would also have a full mortgage lien on our home.

We just found out this great news when we went to refinance our home. So we have to come up with the thousands of dollars to pay them off, and are having a hard time getting the banks to help us because of the lien, we knew nothing about.

The gentleman that is trying to help us refinance our home, said, (he has had four other couples in the past month, that while he was doing the financing on there homes they too found out that Pacesetter had full liens on their homes).

This was a fraudulent transaction if I have ever seen one. We will find out this week if a band will refinance us or not. If not we will have to file bankruptcy. Great, we are going to lose our home over some windows!

While looking through the paper work we received from them, I also notice there are about five different addresses for the company. I tried to contact them and my letter came back, what a surprise! Also they gave us two copies one for Buyer and one for Co-Buyer so they got us both ways. We have never seen such deceptive practices. Please help the others out there that are going to fall in to their trap!

We would have never willing signed this paper work or bought any windows, had we ever been told at anytime about the lien.
Please look into this matter, I know in my heart there are lots of us out there, besides the five I know of now.

From: Steve Sullivan
E-Mail: Private
Subject: They're bugging me already!!! They really DO suck.

Just bought our first home, and suddenly this "Pacesetter

Corp" is calling, wanting to talk. After reading the info

at your site, i do believe it will never go beyond them

leaving messages, and us NOT returning the calls. Thanks

for the info. I should have a page like this for a horrible

car dealer / bank catastrophe, from a year or two back. We

truly live in a world of "caveat emptor".

From: Stephen Kotwicki
E-Mail: Private
Subject: not getting what you want

My name is Stephen Kotwicki I've worked for Pacetter Corp. sence 1996 as a sales rep. also as a assistant sales mananger. And as a sales manager I am one of two who sold over one million dollars in volume in the space of one year. And Out of all those sales that I made for this company I only got one complant. I know the old saying that you can please all the people some of the time some of the people most of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time. All companys are not perfict because they have humans that run them. And humans have flaws. We all make mistakes people do fall under the cracks I do not believe that Pacesetter is out to get any one intentionally. All I can say is any one who feels that you have been miss treated unfairly I have to say I'm very very sory I appoigise for the companys miss comunicating and treating you with disrespect. I wish there was a way we could make you happy and satisfy your needs it is our intent to satisfy every one we do business with. But I do not believe being in this business as long as I have, and running as many leads as I have. That all people can be satisfied I know because of human nature. Some people for some reason don't want to be satisfied. And I can't understand that, some people want things for free the feel that this world owes them and they are going to milk it for all its worth there is a song out there that says I never promised you a rose garden. for all the unhappy customers out there we are sory. We ask that you forgive us for any misunderstandings for not being able to satisfy your needs, for feeling like you were miss lead, left out in the cold, not taken care of, not listened to. For all the 101 mistakes we could have, would have or feel like we had done to you and you only. It has never been our intent to harm any one any time in any way. Thank You for reading. I hope in the future you days are much brighter, may the wind be always at your back, may you find the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow may all yor dreams come true. The light of God serounds you the love of God infolds you the power of God protects you and the presents of God watches over you where ever you are God is and all is well!

From: Chris La Mar
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter Plant Closure

I just found out Pacesetter is going out of business. They are auctioning off their Manufactoring Plant in Omaha. I have a copy of the Auction ad if you want to post it. I worked for them in the mid 90's. I now work for an Honest Company. Your site is great, and people who run things dishonestly should be held accountable.

From: lorraine
E-Mail: Private
Subject: a call from pacesetter

I got a call today all i heard was Hello mr, and it was cut off. On my caller id i read pacesetter corp. I got on the internet to search who the hell that was and i ran into your site. Wow i feel for you and i will mention i went to pacesettersucks.com and dont call back.
Yeah
lorraine

From: me again
E-Mail: Private
Subject: company employees

it has been told among the pacsetter operation to be passed along that this sight exist and for any employee that post good notes about the company will get a bonus of some sorts .i was even told as much . pondering the thought ..... why would the company i work for ask me to do such if something was not wrong ............... food for thought .

From: brian
E-Mail: Private
Subject: lets take it to pacesetter

I,M A FORMER EMPLOYEE AS OF TODAY . I WAS AN INSTALLATION MANAGER FOR THIS RIDICULIOUS SO CALLED COMPANY. I HAVE SOME GRAVE NEWS FOR ALL PACESETTER CUSTOMERS. GENERALLY SPEAKING COSTING,WARRANTY IS NOT WHAT CUSTOMERS ARE TOLD ,PRODUCTS ARE NOT EXCLUSIVE AS CLAIMED AND I CAN GET WITH ANY LOCAL BUILDING INSPECTOR AND TURN THEIR WORLD UPSIDE DOWN . I,M WANTING TO START A CLASS ACTION SUIT AGAINST THIS COMPANY TO TAKE THEM OUT OF OPPERATION. I HAVE THE INSIDE KNOWLEDGE OF THE MATERIALS AND INSTALLATION.I WAS NOT FIRED I RESIGNED ,DO TO THE FACT I HAVE A CONCIOUS. I HAVE ALOT OF DETAILS BUT NOT FOR POSTING RIGHT NOW .FOR ALL CUSTOMERS WHOM HAVE A PROBLEM GETTING IN CONTACT WITH SOME ONE IN THAT COMPANY I HAVE THE FULL LIST OF NUMBERS A THE COOPERATE OFFICE EVEN CELL NUMBERS ,THEY BURNT MINE UP ENOUGH. ANY ONE INTERESTED PLEASE CONTACT ME VIA E MAIL AT cutandnail@yahoo.com make the subject "righting a wrong". thank you all !

From: J.Book West Coast
E-Mail: Private
Subject: I'm scared

I wish I had found this website before I signed a contract with Pacesetters. My work has not even begun, and I'm worried because of the articles I've just read. I'm having a new single door installed along with two large picture windows, and one smaller window over the kitchen sink. I can only pray that the work will be done efficiently and professionally. My total cost is a little over $5,000, and I too am being financed at 12%. I have always considered myself to be smart in regards to business, but I'm not feeling that smart right now. I guess the bottom line is like one of the articles said. "Any contract that has to be signed "today" is not the type of contract you should enter into". I hope this adventure turns out o.k. for me.

Thanks for this site.

From: suck my balls(soccer of course)
E-Mail: Private
Subject: finger eachothers jizz sacks(whatever)

decrepit old faggot/dyke combo. Oh poor babies, suck on daddys one eyed complaint stick. I love the web. You shouldnt be offended, i am just letting my fustrations out.
I hope your windows fall out on top of you both. they should. I wish, I wish upon a dish that you live your lives out in a ditch. No I dont. Ill be eating pussy while your eating crow. Mr and Mrs Redding CA. I love you both and would like to have you for dinner. MY TREAT"><":"
wow e-mail looks familiar--jekyl and hyde thats me and me tooooooo. conversations always work better with two. thats why i keep spares in the closet, no not really. Really??? Hope your not scared i am not. this was fun hun.
got to go, i have a ho, with some blow--YOU know!!!
I have three eyes and am black and blue what am I?? Im you
boy your hard to chew out with words. Your so wise and I am not,just around the corner , OHHHH your caught;;
dont let them catch you they are not nice, for they are black and you are rice.




SLEEP TIGHT

From: William Hall
E-Mail: Private
Subject: The positive side of Pacesetter

This website is the exact idea of what is wrong with the world today. Everybody expects everthing and everybody to be perfect. We all have things that we would like to change but the world is what it is, NOT FAIR. It is unfortunate that people going to this website are only seeing the downside of Pacesetter. If every company had a person open a website when they were disappointed with the service or product of that said company than the net would be full of negative websites for every company and business out there. Dont get me wrong, I do feel bad about people not getting the proper respect when spending money with a company and not getting what they expected. It has happened to me more times than I could count. I have worked for Pacesetter for almost 9 years in the service department and have recieved the companies highest award for customer service 3 times in a row. I can only speak for myself but I provide service like the customers were my own family. Some of my most satisfied customers have had some similar experience as some of the people on this website have. I know for a fact that the positive experiences outweigh the negative ones. Anyway, alot of good people work for Pacesetter and have raised their families with the company. As for ex-employees that write in I can only say this, at Pacesetter as long as you do your job correctly and to the best of your ability and give respect to the customers than you have a job for the life of the company. I do not usually write in on things but as long as this website over shadows the positives of Pacesetter than my livelyhood is at stake and that scares me. I have a family and Pacetter helps me support them and I am grateful for that. The company has always been a stickler for customer service and we try to satisfy everybody but in reality that is impossible in todays world of people wanting things faster and better which in my mind is a conflictive statement. Anyway I hope you post this feedback on your website because my fate possibly lies in your hands and surely in Pacesetters hands. I know I will try just as hard as ever to satisfy the customers of Pacesetter.


Thanks For Your Time,

Will Hall
Service Tech (Sacramento)

From: Debbie
E-Mail: Private
Subject: need to get a life

Ihavespent the better part of my afternoon reading everything on this web site, Iam a business owner and a motherof a child with cancer,and also the wife of along time current employee of pacesetter.I think that you had abad sale and service with pacesetter and maybe your not happy with them but Ithink you must be a very shollow and boring person to be putting this on your list of priorties.I have mostly read about unhappy exemployees and very old simple cases about salesmen. I think we can all agree that we do not live in a per fect world and not all companys are great but at least this company is still opporating in the USA and when you do call at least your speaking to someone in the USA.Just remember when your looking for bad you can always find it maybe you should try looking for some good in your life! Maybe thank GOD you have a house or that you have time to type on your web site because your not fighting in the war. I hope maybe you can someday put this to rest and fight for something to help make a better life for everyone. GOD BLESS

From: shana
E-Mail: Private
Subject: curious

Did you ever get paid, because I was with the company for almost a month and I still have not recieved a paycheck yet. I signed up for automatic deposit because they listed it as an option and now they are telling my mother that they never carried automatic deposit and I have already talked to payroll and they also said they did automatic deposit. Do You have any suggestions on who I can talk to, because they have also changed the amount per hour I am supposed to be paid. you can contact me by my email address or I left a story so you leave your answer there too. It would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you

From: Shana Swartwout
E-Mail: Private
Subject: former employee

I was hired Aug 21 2004 to be a greeter for pacesetters and the home service store in St. Cloud Sam's Club. Right from the start, my first supervisor's answer to everything was "I don't care, I have bigger fish to fry." I hadn't been trained in so I couldn't meet my quota of 8 people a day, and 2 weeks went by before I found out that I was supposed to be getting paid every week. I had another coworker who worked mornings who also hadn't recieved her paycheck for the last couple of weeks. She was told by the supervisor that she wouldn't get her check until he met her and my check wasn't in because I was missing paperwork. I had given my paperwork to him in person, so I called him to ask what paperwork was missing and he accused me of plotting with the coworker against him. So pacesetters sent in another superviser from Ohio who promised to get everything straightened out.I asked him about the first supervisor and his answer was the guy was acting this way because they had put him under too much pressure without training him in and he was still with the company. The second supervisor then said he was here to help us get business up. My coworker quit after one day with him because he wanted her to physically block customers from leaving until they signed up for a consultation. He said the reason why we weren't meeting our quota was because of our sales technique. We tried to explain that people will complain to the manager if we do that, but he said if we smile the whole time, no one would report us for harassment. I admit I needed to be more confidnent in my sales pitch, but I also know St. Cloud where I worked. It is a college town, most people live in dorms or rent homes/apartments. Those that have their own homes are done with home improvement around the beginning of August or have construction workers in the family who do it for little or for free. And they don't like to be pushed into stuff that they don't want. We tried to tell the new supervisor this, and my mother works at Sam's Club and she tried to tell him the same thing also and he is still convinced that even on a slow day we can pull our quotas in. The day I worked with him for 2 hours, he got 12 people because he chased them down and wouldn't let them leave until they signed up or he was satisfied with their rejection. I got one person that day and it was because he was taking everyone so I didn't get the chance to talk to people. He tried to work with me in the break room on my pitch and this is where he made me uncomfortable. He said a sales pitch was like dating when it comes to the last line of the pitch whis is "Which one of these would you like more information for further down the road?" His exact words were "A sales pitch is like asking someone out on a date, that last line lets the customer think they are in control of the conversation and they will say yes to being signed up. Its like if I were to go up to you and say would you like to have dinner on Thursday, You would tell me no. But if I tell you that I want to take you on Friday or Saturday you are going to say yes right?" I tried to tell him that if I didn't want to go out with a guy, I was going to tell him no regardless of the pitch and he said that the only reason I was disagreeing with him is because we both knew that his asking me on a date was just an example. Then I brought up my paycheck again and he told me it would be in on monday the 13 of Sept. I went and sat in my mom's car at 1:30 pm on Sept 12 because I wasn't feeling well and he said he was going for a cigarette break. The next day I checked my bank because I have direct deposit and it wasn't there so I called him and said I would not be in Tuesday, and he told me my check would be in on Tuesday and to come in on Wed and he or my first supervisor would come in and train me. Then he told me that He had gotten 6 more people between 1:30 and 3 pm on Sunday which I would like to see how that is possible because I didn't leave Sam's Club that day and I wandered in and out of the store and no one saw him in the store after I punched out at 1:30. In fact my mom called me on my cell at 4:30 to let me know he hadn't been seen since I left and that he had left the table out, and she had to put away the demo table. On Wed I showed up and he didn't say anything about anyone coming to train me in and just asked me to call in a couple of hours and report to him if I had anyone and that my check would for sure be in my account on Thursday at midnight and that I could access it on Friday Sept 17 2004. I punched in at 11 am and around 1:30 I called to tell him I had not gotten anyone yet but the store was starting to get busy. Also a lot of the people I talked to had already talked to him. He then told me that I was wasting his time, the company's time and money and to just punch out and he would call me that night and tell me what time to come in for more training. He never called me, I was supposed to be entered in the blackberry computer system and he never trained me in on that and today is Friday, my check was not there. So I didn't go in to work and I am now job hunting. I would like to take the coroporation to court because I had the demo supervisor at Sam's Club who in a way is my supervisor there, call the payroll office and the guy there told me on Wednesday also that my check would be in on Thursday. And he would call the president, my boss to have him call me about the other stuff that was going on. He refused to give us a number to contact my main boss and he never called us back. So I called him today to tell him about my paycheck and big surprise he didn't answer his phone so I left a message and called the demo supervisor. I have also been trying to find out who to contact in the company about complaints but no one will tell me and Everyone at Sam's Club thinks that pacesetter and the Home Service Store is hiding something. And this has been my experience with pacesetters and to my knowledge, my coworker recieved one of her checks but is stilled owed one more for the first 2 weeks of Sept.
Sincerely
Shana Swartwout

From: Nancy Wright
E-Mail: Private
Subject: More from Pacesetters

I just wanted to tell you that Pacesetters is still doing business as usual. I only had 6 windows installed so I could try them out and not go to deeply in debt. While I did think their price and interest was too high, I let myself be sold.
The salesman and I talked about the whole lien-on-the-house thing, repeatedly. I told him I wasn't going to get the windows if it involved a lien. I was also told repeatedly that the price had to be over $5,000 before they put a lien on the property. I made a down payment to ensure that the amount financed was under the $5000 limit.
So I am refinancing my house and the people call to ask me what the lien is on my house from Federal Diversified Services. I about went through the roof.
I just found out a few minutes ago and, of course, the finance company is closed for the day. I can't say yet how this will come out but at least I don't owe them too much and can pay it off if they won't take this lien off my house.
So, their business practices have not changed.
I am in San Diego and Pacesetters has joined up with Sam's Club so they are being allowed to solicit customers in the stores. I like Sam's so I hope they wise up soon. I already called Sam's home service store to complain and will certainly be calling them back if I can't get the lien removed.

From: Mr. & Mrs Walter Yonkey
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter Sucks

We to, have had trouble with Pacesetter.
Our Double hung window, sags and the workmanship. as far as the caulking sucks. Very Sloppy.

We have talked to several sales Reps, when they call to sell us windows and told them of our problem, they state they will report it to management, and we hear nothing. I have called Pacesetter several times and left messages but no return calls.

We will not recomend Pacesetter products to no one.
I tell anyone and everyone that will listen. Pacesetter does NOT stand behind their product or workmanship.

From: Mark Thompson
E-Mail: Private
Subject: question from reporter

Greetings,

I'm writing a story for Online Journal Review (OJR.org) about ChillingEffects.com, which posted the cease & desist letter you received from Pacesetter Corp. in April of 2003.

Since you're Web site is still up, it would appear that Pacesetter failed to shut you down. Has the company given up trying to stop you from using your domain name? Did ChillingEffects.org help you fend off the company?

Any comments you can offer by email or phone will be appreciated.

Thanks,

Mark Thompson
(310) 558-8466

Admin's Response: I haven't heard anything from Pacesetter Corp in quite a while, so I assume they've given up trying to shut the site down. I think that setting up the guestbook system for posting messages might have made it more difficult for them, since the posts were no longer hosted on my server and were no longer filtered. And the argument about the domain name violating their trademark was absurd, as has been shown in many court cases.

But who knows, maybe they never intended to take legal action anyway. It could have all been scare tactics. I mean, if they were in good financial shape, why would they have closed the factory and sold the company? Well anyway, other than posting the cease & desist letter we received, ChillingEffects.org never got involved with the situation.

Thanks for writing, and I hope this helps!

From: anon add on
E-Mail: Private
Subject:

oh yeah, maybe ALL the offices wouldnt be closing, if they didnt keep spending billions on sending everyone to the carribbean, (which i was promised and didnt get) and feb 04 everyone went to cabo

From: Anon
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Ex-Employee

Ok, I was an employee for about 3 weeks. Much hard and LONG work was ahead for me. I worked my ass off, in order to please the managers and prove I could do the job right. On 9-1-04 I came in at 9am as usual to get my leads, and was told Corporate was closing the WA office due to $$, some crap about too much money going out, not enough coming in. Bam, rents due, Im screwed, No notice NADA!!!!!!!! I was actually told about this website at the begining by Joe Blessinger our manager, GREAT guy! But, he has been brain washed by Pacesetters as well, I really thought that while I was running leads, that if I couldnt close the sale, then the client was the idiot. Now, jobless, I have been researching many other window companies, and they have the same product at much better prices. Im seriously thinking about applying there as well. Hell, I have the free-training that was given, why not use it. In conclusion, after MUCH reading on this site, and other window comps.... DO NOT USE PACESETTERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was taught to make the customer feel like crap if they didnt buy from me. Now I see thats wrong, especially when you are invited into a persons home... thats WRONG!

From: Paul J
E-Mail: Private
Subject: I worked for Pacesetter

Hello, I worked for Pacesetter as a tela-marketer about 18 years ago out of one of their offices in Roseville, Mn.

After reading your short summary of what this company did to you I am not surprised !
I was employed with Pacesetter for about 6 months, I think, it was a long time ago. But, the short time I was there I could see that this company was run by a bunch of swindling loosers.
My job was to "cold call" anybody, basically from the phone book, and give them my pitch, never using my real name. We would send our "representative" out to the clients home, actually a salesman, and hopefully he/she would sell them windows, siding or a security system.
The best people to call were the one's living outside of the metro area because they were not used to tela-marketers and were easier to pitch to.
There was also drug dealing and gambling going on at the "office" on a daily basis, even the general manager was involved. I am surprised that this company has lasted this long.

That's about it, thanks.

From: Rebecca Schmidt
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Desperate Salesmen

Warning: My story is long and detailed but hopefully it will help someone. The morale of the story is follow your gut feeling.

My story is different in the fact that I had little contact with the company. I did not buy anything and a salesmen never entered my home. That is the disturbing part. They gave me such a bad feeling that I looked them up online and came across this website.

This is my story: I got a phone call at 8:15 at night. I thought that was late for telemarketing so I answered the phone. Fifteen minutes later I was off the phone thinking that it was the most aggressive telemarketing I had ever experienced. The woman on the asked if I was married, asked when I worked, what my hours were, could I be home at such and such time.

I was very annoyed but so caught off guard by the questions that I did not directly say no to an appointment. The telemarketer did not seem to care that I was obviously not interested. She kept asking if I could make it a point to be at home at noon. I told her I didn't know and blew off the call thinking if a salesman came by I just wouldn't answer the door. No big deal.

The next morning at 11:30 there was a knocking at the front door. I didn't answer. Then they came to my side door. The knocking turned into pounding. I was home alone and that aggressive knocking kind of scared me. My house is small and it should have been obvious that I was either not home or avoiding them.

They stopped knocking after several minutes and started walking around my house. They were probably looking at the windows and making sure I wasn't outside but it gave me the creeps. I locked all the doors and turned off the TV and figured they would go away. I didn't answer because I thought they would be really aggressive and hard to get rid of (keep in mind I had never heard of them or seen this website). Plus, I work in the evening so I was tired and in PJs and really didn't want strange men bothering me.

A couple of minutes later I looked out my front window and saw the salesmen in a black suburban(which had no signs or markings on it) What were they waiting for? Did they know I was home? If they thought I wasn't, were they planning to ambush me when I walked up to my door? Then Pacesetters called. I almost answered and was going to tell them to have their salesmen leave. But at that point I figured not knowing if I was home would be more irritating for them. I decided to take a nap a figured they would leave soon. An hour later they knocked (or should I say pounded) and called again, I didn't answer. Another hour later my roommate got home and said no strange vehicles were outside. My roommate happens to be a guy, 6'4" and built. I think the telemarketer assumed I lived alone when I said I wasn't married so I am guessing my roommate scared them away. (number one reason for having a male roommate)

Later that day my next door neighbor said she didn't know who the salesmen were and almost called the police. She said they stared at her and gave her a wierd looks. She was also home alone that day. She told me they were there for at least 2 hours straight and she noticed they moved their vehicle twice without leaving our street. So that is a long story but I thought it was super creepy.

I could have prevented the whole thing by being my assertive but I did not think they would stake out my house. They have called several times since then but I haven't been home. Next time I will answer and tell them to leave me alone. I consider this harrassment. I don't know if they really did anything illegal but I think they were out of line. I feel like I have a stalker. So, even though I have had such minimal contact with that company I was disturbed enough to look them up online (I started to wonder if they were a legit company). When I came across this site I felt better knowing that they are a bunch of creeps and I wasn't imagining that gut feeling that they would have ruined my day, if not more. At the same time I feel bad for the people that did answer the door and get conned into buying their products. I think this sales technique is wrong and disturbing. Have they heard of trespassing and loitering? Beware if they call you and warn your friends and family. Sorry for the lengthly message I hope it saves someone from dealing with them. I learned a few lessons.

From: matt kleinsmith
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetter should be shut down

I use to be an employee with pacesetter (BIGGEST MISTAKE OF MY LIFE). I was an in home sales rep in cincinnati,oh. Pacesetter teaches there sales reps to lie to there costumers about there products and how good they are. They teach there sales reps to never leave a house under 3 hours. There products are so over priced it should be a crime. I've been in home improvements for six years and this is the worst company I have ever seen. They should be shut down immediatly. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

From: Lisa
E-Mail: Private
Subject: a room with a view

Last week I responded to an employment ad for pacesetter corp. that read "telephone operators... no selling! no appointment setting! no exp neccessary" When I called they set me up for an interview. I walked into a room with 5 other women. None of us were told it would be a group interview. The first thing the manager did was give us a sales pitch about the company and all the prizes you can win and the fun atmosphere. Since no one else was asking good questions, I asked about the pay and positions available. He named several positions, mostly making outbound calls ("no cold calls"). There was only one position that didnt involve selling and it was the least pay, just above minimum. That was the first deception. He was aware that most of us were there because we needed a job and he acted like he was doing us a big favor. So I took the position because I needed the money very badly (we live in a very economically depressed area).
When I reported to work, nobody seemed to be expecting me. It was a hectic atmosphere, very tense. I have worked in sales offices before, but this was different. About 12 people were on the phone and talking quite loudly. I was given a phone to monitor conversations so I could learn what I'd I'd be doing. People were being told that they had responded to some advertising (they had either been pressured to fill out a card at sams club or kmart, or they had responded to a tv ad with Bob Eubanks). And then they were told they needed to have a sales rep come out to show them samples. Some ppl were cool with that, but the ones that werent had to go thru the whole "rebuttal" process. Depending on the phone operator, the potential customer was either badgered into having a rep come out for a free estimate that would "only cost them a smile" or they were just allowed to refuse. The one operator who seemed to have some integrity (he was older)was the one who got the most leads, but very few "next day" appointments. Apparently he was very concerned about that. I guess that meant no bonus for him. I didnt really like the way the smart @$$ kid who was the group manager was treating him like crap and constantly referring to another operator (who seemed to be in her 40's) as "grandma" in a very sarcastic tone. I started to wonder how he was going to end up treating me.
It was a very unprofessional atmosphere and everyone seemed to be under a lot of pressure. And this was my first day!!!
Fortunately I decided to check out their website before I was to return to work. I did a search and your site came up 2nd and of course I was curious. Thank God I read this! I stayed up all night and read every one of the entries!!
I would not be able to have a clear conscience knowing I was setting up ppl for a rip off! And sending these reps to just anywhere. As one guy was taking a call the other operator noticed the neighborhood of the person on the screen and said "nobody living there can afford these windows! why are we sending someone there?" I started remember little things like that after I read your site and now I'm getting out before it's too late! I'm quitting today!! I dont care how much I need the money. I'll get another job where I can leave the office with dignity and the satisfaction that I hepled someone and didnt rip them off!

From: mime
E-Mail: Private
Subject:

pacesetters have called at least 6 times a day no matter what you tell them their phone number i got off caller ID 210-694-2115 i told them to leave me alone and stop calling and they laugh and call again and again i am turning it over to the attorney general in texas lets see who will get the last laugh

From: chris wills
E-Mail: Private
Subject: my ten years at pacesetter

I have worked at pacesetter for the last 10 succesful years as a rep,assistant sales manager and a sales manager. Unfortunately like alot of bigger companies like Pacsetter that have been in business for a long time, you are going to have some disgruntle ex-employees and some jobs that don't work out perfect. I was part of these situations myself. All in all I have no problems with the way we did business. The company was always fair to me and my customers. I left the company April 1,2004. Without Pacesetter, I would not have the opportunities I have today.

Thanks,

Christopher Wills

From: merrick
E-Mail: Private
Subject: word from the inside

I know that coming on here is probobly going to cost me whatever job I have with the pacesetter corp of America but this needs to be known.

Customers are not the only ones getting screwed. And we know who does the screwing to the customers as well.

This is my expieriance with Pacesetter in the past 3 years.

I started working in the telemarketing offices in 2002 thinking that we were acdtually giving people a great deal on a fantastic product. Little did I know after talking to some old customers what we were doing to them. We were sending guys out there basically lieing to them and telling them that the products were good for life with warranty when actually we charged people every time we came out and added a aditional charge to their bill as well.

It is worse on the other side of the fence, 98 percent of the people who call the folks in homeowner land are convicted felons, x-cons, addicts, alchohollics, and scam artists too boot. I worked for all of these people and there were times where I single handedly wittnessed company standards thrown right out the window because "oh that person who shows up twice a week makes us 25k a week as well." as an excuse.

I was an assistant manager for a year then was demoted due to a corperate downsizing that did not change my rate of pay but took away what I had worked my ass off for two years to get. So fed up I joined another department of the company and did not do so well and came back to telemarketing.

Things were good for a while and then I got promoted again to my assistant manager position. I worked in the position for a total of six weeks because we have a June push every year where we hustle people more than usual to squeeze a few dollars more out of retired and disabled folks and that was my strong point was getting people who actually bought stuff that were not. See when you kick a rep out of a house and he does not have a houase to go to he is considered burnt out, there for he needs a new lead to go to. this could happen at any time between 10am and 8pm on the weekdays. And I was the one to go to if you wanted to be in a house.

Well after the push I was demoted again and dropped wages because "we cannot afford to pay telemarketers more than x ammount an hour" when they were paying a guy I hired a year ago a whole dollar and 50 cents more than me to do the same job. And they hired several other less reliable people back to do the same job and not show up to work for almost 3 dollars more than what I was being paid an hour.

So I hope you all in the corperate office are readiong this, I am your most faithful employee and this is how you treat the ones who have done everything to make you money. You suck and I hope for your sakes and mine you change the way you do buisness back to the way it was years ago, when the grunts got paid what they were worth, not what you want them to think they are.

From: Tom
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter

I worked for Pacesetter for more then ten years had a good time and made lots of money. the Comp is a grest Comp to work for and cares for its cust,the people you have talked to on this site sound like people who are trying to get something for nothing!!! The windows are great and priced great as well.People are all ways trying to get something for free if you order the windows and have them installed then pay for them!!If you are not happy call cut service they will take great care of you.I also was a telemareter for five years never had any trouble with that great Comp!!!

From: Lena Wagoner
E-Mail: Private
Subject: 5 phone calls three missed appointments

I am so glad I came across this site I believe it has saves
me alot of grief as much of you have seem to have .
I can not believe a company could have such SORRY customer sevice and manage to still stay in business. I have never experienced such a lack of concern for a customers needs.
Looking at some of their pricing I could have never afforded their so call great product anyway. If someone from pacesetter reads this thanks for wasting my time.
Better that than my money. Have a great day

From: Roger Anderson
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Windows

Dear Sir:
I have read your letter. I was wondering which window you have found and would buy. Which company makes a good window. My daughter and soninlaw have put in windows in a new house and they are junk from the word go. The so called low E-glass let's all kinds of heat in and I'm sure cold out. When you mow the grass outside the window the sound inside is like the window is open. The house is only 5 years old. I would like to know what is good.

Please post it on your site and I will look for what you call "BEST WINDOWS"

Thanks

Roger

From: randy
E-Mail: Private
Subject: A telemarketing story

I worked for pacesetter as a telemarketer & telemarketing manager for 7 years. They control your life completely working 50-60 hours a week. Although the telemarketing has closed in the city I live it still continues around the country. While I was a manager I saw drugs being taken and distributed throughout the company from the veriest highest manager on down and everyone knew about it.I am still a telemarketing manager for another company that has ethics.I could take longer and tell just about anything anyone would want to know about the company becaues I spent all 7 years across the street from corporate headquarters if anyone has any questions give them my e-mail address

From: A Preston
E-Mail: Private
Subject: What Lifetime warranty?

My husband and I bought our house in 1990, we took over payments of the Pacesetters Windows. We were happy with the windows. 2 years later we needed some repairs done to the windows, locks broke, window wouldn't close, etc. From 1990 till this month July 2004 all we paid was the 40 dollars service fee because we had the "Lifetime Warranty. We have had the windows worked on 5 or 6 times. Then this months I was told that the so called "lifetime warranty" wasn't good anymore. It's sad when a lifetime is less then 20 years. I'll be happy to see Pacesetters go under. They aren't worth the high cost you have to pay. Now we are stuck with pulleys that don't work and I will never give Pacesetter any more of my money, if you know anyone else that can fix these windows let me know.

From: David Dreyer
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Iv'e been there

I used to work for Pacesetter back in 1988 and again in 99. O the stories I could tell!

From: Charles Haeuser
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Some bad experiences

I am currently a Pacesetter employee. I have never been trained to lie, nor have I lied to a customer. What I have been reading on this site appalls me. I have many satisfied customers, and it seems strange to me how this site would allow speculative, and slanderous information to be put on this site. In regards to the nightmare story, that issue has been resolved with the BBB and was taken care of to the bureau's satisfaction. Read the review of pacesetter on that site. Our windows are more for a reason. We have a money-back guarantee, we have second to none installation, and a lifetime warranty that really means something, since we have been in business since 1962! We have over 1 million customers. This company does stand behind it's work. We will do the very best we can in all situations. People are human, sometimes, when you have as many customers as we do, things happen. My experience has been that we do everything that we can to ensure the job is done correctly the first time, and we stand behind it if it is not. As far as using a mortgage as a security interest with a median interest rate, this is done as a convenience to the homeowner. If someone defaulted on their payments, would you rather have the windows, or the front door repossessed? OF COURSE NOT. If you cannot afford cash, and many can't, financing gives people the option of an affordable monthly payment. If you can get a better rate, get one, and pay the loan off. NO BIG DEAL. Credit cards are higher, so are some car loans. We use the average interest rates, across the country to determine ours. There are honest, hard-working people at this company, who have families to support. Please do not de-fame this company or it's employees. We would appreciate it. God bless.

From: Melinda & Jeff Baldwin
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pace Setters Kitchen Cabinets

I am writing to find out if anyone has info on their cabinets. Although after having three sets of sales persons come to our home, reading this website and finding out that they will put a lien against our property, I highly doubt we will use them. Exactly what I have read is true, the sales people are pushy and do try to close the deal that night. Luckily for my husband and I we have a waiting period of at least 24 hours and we check out all options before buying. I am glad this website is here to inform me of some persons' experiences. I am sure that this company does also have its' share of satisfied customers. We have had two salesmen that had a hard time takeing no for an answer already and this third time they sent out two salesmen. They were very charming, but it took them forever to get to the point that they were at our home for. Then they still never gave us a firm price. I have a feeling we will go to Lowe's or Home Depot and use a local contractor for our kitchen project.

Sincerely,
Jeff & Melinda Baldwin
San Antonio, TX

From: Rich Haney
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Re:I worked for Pacesetter

I worked for Pacesetter and was led to believe I would be living the "Good Life". It couldn't have been further from the truth.
Back in June of 2003 I was looking for work during a hard time for jobs. I was trying to make some money for my finacee and our child. when I came upon a job posting on the internet for a job that was too good to be true, and was it ever. During my interview with Mike Oldenburg, who was 2 years younger than me and was already a manager making 90-100k a year (so he said), he asked me if I would have any problem asking people for $2 - $4,000. I of course told him no, but a big red flag popped up in my head. I should have denied the position, but I needed a job.
My first day of training we were being taught by the assistant manager cause the manager had a wedding. there was 1 other rep in there with the 2 of us. We then each went with one of the reps to go on leads. I went with the assistant manager who told me that this was a great company and he loved working for them. But I couldn't understand why he had already quit once a couple of months ago. Well we went to our first lead and it was a dead end. He said those hardly ever happen. So he asked me if I had any money to go to the bar until the next lead. I said sure. He called the other rep, using my cell phone, to meet us at a local pub and shoot some pool and drink a couple of beers.
when we arrived at the bar, me or the other new rep didn't have to spend a dime. They both bought us beer and themselves. While we were there for about 2 hours and 4-5 beers later we left for the next and last lead. we went to our lead and it was a run down farm that the house looked like it was falling apart, but no one was home. I had made a comment to him that they probably wouldn't be able to afford the windows anyway, and he said to me that he could get any contract approved through Federal Diverisfied Services (which is the bank that Pacesetter owns). It didnt't matter whether they could afford it or not, just get the contract signed. And since that on one was at that lead, we went and sat a bar again and drank beer and shot pool while we waited for another lead. He told me that most reps do this, but never get drunk, and don't let the leads smell the beer on your breath. He made it sound like it was the way of pacesetter.
When I finally got out on my own, I had some "Bad Luck". I would go to 3-4 leads a day, and most of them were about 30-50 miles away from our office, and I would be lucky to get into one house. No one was ever home. All of the leads would come out and say that they were comfirmed but I ran into a few leads that said that they told them they didn't want anyone to come out cause they weren't interested. But they just set up a time based on some information the telemarketers had taken down during the intial call. I even had a lead at 7:30 one night to drive 80-90 miles from the office to a lead at an address......So I drove all the way there arriving about 8:30 or so, I was only about 30 miles away at the time, and there was no one who lived at the address by that name and no one had even called that house. I was PI#$%^ off. I had put on 340 miles in that one day.
I was getting pretty tired of Pacesetter and realized that it was just a big Hoax. And then one day I was riding with the same assistant manager and he told me that he had to stop by a customer of his that he had sold some windows to before and then some siding to recently, and that his wife was after time to cancel the order. So he went over there to save the order. It was the 3rd day that he had to cancel the order. When we got there it was a Little Hmong guy and all of his children. His wife was there but she was busy with the kids. So we sat down and he told Zach that he wanted to cancel the order because he didn't want another morgage added to him home. He told him that if he signed this sheet of paper there wouldn't be another morgage added to his home.....guess what that was exactly what he was adding when I watched hime sign that paper. Zach told me when we got in the car that he wasn't canceling that order by no meens. I was disgusted by the unethical business practices of Pacesetter.
Everything I have read on the website is absolutely true. The pressure and the making the customers feel guilty that this is how you make your living is absolutely true!!!!!!
there is one thing that isn't said in this website.....one of Pacesetters big selling points is that only window guys install their windows, which is false!!!!!!!!!!! Their contractors install every product that they have. Each one doesn't have their own "experts"!!!!!!!!!

From: Shard'e
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter does suck ( word from a former employee)

I just recently got a job from pacesetter. the pay period is thursday to friday but i always seem to get my check 3 to 4 days later. i quit recently and i still have not received a check i quit on june 27th. when i called my boss to get the number to someone who is above him he refused to give it to me. so im doing my research!

From: Edward Hetzer
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Estimted Front Door Costs

I am a widower gentleman, 86 years of age. I called the Pacesetter Corp for an estimate on replacing my front door with a new more modern one.
Two gentleman showed up at my door about a week later, they came in and for an hour and a half they explaned the benifits of their company to me. I kept asking about the estimated cost of the front door, I did look at some pictures of doors but the cost was not on the pictures.
After more than a hour and a half they finally gave me a price of $5600 for replacing my front door, but the TODAY price would be $4300 if I singed the contract at that time.
I have never did business when anyone wanted for me to sign at the first meeting. I felt I was being pressered into signing this contract.
I have received about four or five calls from this company in the past few weeks, I have caller ID on my phone and I just dont answer when I see this name of my caller ID.
Just want to pass on this little information to others that might get high pressered into signing a contract with this company. Thanks for reading.

From: Veronica Vides
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Hola

Is this the same Greg Mendoza who lived right off Grand/Austin?

From: rick stuart
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Boo-Hoo

Shut-up...

All this crying is making me sick. I worked for Pacesetter and yes it did suck. I've taken from that experience the ability to understand what I "Don't whant to be". I currently have my own company, Pacesetter sent me a "stop your business or we'll sue you letter". The letter was sent from their corporate headquarters. I laughed out loud and showed my friends what kind of company I used to work for. They hired a manager that went to prison, he's in prison now. Keith Ives is his name and he once was a Sales Manager at a branch in Tulsa now he is serving time in Texas over a seperate incident. You can check out Keiths record @ oscn.net...Oklahoma. Now you know what kind of people they hire.

From: JOHN LAUGHLIN
E-Mail: Private
Subject: YOUR WEBSITE IS SCREWING WITH MY LIFE.

MY NAME IS JOHN LAUGHLIN, AND ALTHOUGH I AM NO LONGER AN EMPLOYEE OF PACESETTER, YOUR WEBSITE IS SCREWING WITH MY LIFE.

THERE ARE SOME DEROGATORY POSTS ON YOUR WEBSITE THAT PEOPLE ARE CLAIMING WERE POSTED BY ME, ALTHOUGH THE ONLY POST THAT I HAVE LEFT ON THIS SITE IS THE "EMPLOYEE REBUTTAL" POST ON YOUR SCROLLBAR TO THE LEFT. I HAVE NEVER SAID A BAD THING ABOUT PACESETTER, AND PEOPLE THAT I COULD CALL MY FRIENDS BEFORE YOUR IRRESPONSIBLE WEBSITE (THAT DOESN'T EVEN BOTHER TO POST THE NAMES OF THE INDIVIDUALS WHO MAKE POSTS)NOW DON'T WANT TO COMMUNICATE WITH ME BECAUSE THEY THINK I'M SLAMMING THEM.

YOUR SITE IS IRRESPONSIBLE AND CHILDISH. IF YOU WANT TO MAKE THIS THING OFFICIAL, AT LEAST MAKE PEOPLE SIGN UP FOR A FORUM POSTING SERVICE ON THIS THING WITH E-MAIL VERIFICATION SO THAT NOT JUST ANYONE CAN GET ON HERE PRETENDING TO BE SOMEONE ELSE AND TALK TRASH. YOU WANT TO BE UPSET WITH THE COMPANY, THAT'S YOUR BUSINESS, BUT THIS THING REACHES FARTHER THAN YOU OBVIOUSLY REALIZE. PEOPLE THAT I WOULD HAVE TRUSTED MY LIFE WITH HAVE ASSUMED THAT I HAVE POSTED DEROGATORY THINGS HERE THAT I NEVER HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH. I MADE A CLEAN BREAK FROM PACESETTER AND LEFT WITH NO BAD BLOOD.

WHAT HAPPENS IN MY PERSONAL LIFE WITH INDIVIDUALS DOES NOT GET POSTED ON THE INTERNET FOR GOD'S SAKE, AND YET YOUR IRRESPONSIBLE AND RIDICULOUS WEBSITE GIVES PEOPLE JUST THAT ABILITY.

REMOVE THESE UNMONITORED POSTS AND REGULATE WHAT IS POSTED ON YOUR SITE, OR I MIGHT CONSIDER LEGAL ACTION MYSELF, AGAINST YOU. YOU HAVE PROVIDED A FORUM HERE WHERE A SIMPLE DISLIKING FOR A COMPANY CAN BECOME PERSONAL ISSUES WITH INDIVIDUALS AT VARYING NATIONAL OFFICES, AND THAT IS SICKENING.

THERE ARE PEOPLE AT THE END OF THESE ACCUSATIONS WHO HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH QUALITY OF WORK OR PRICING. I HAVE LOST FRIENDS AND PEOPLE THAT I WOULD CALL MY FAMILY BECAUSE YOU SUCK. SO, SINCE THIS IS OPEN FORUM AND I CAN SAY WHAT I LIKE, LET ME SAY IT AGAIN: YOU SUCK.

YOU'VE TURNED YOUR PETTY GRIPE WITH PACESETTER INTO A PLACE WHERE ANONYMOUS INDIVIDUALS CAN COME AND SAY ANYTHING THEY WANT.

WHY DON'T YOU SET UP A FORUM SITE INSTEAD OF THIS UNMONITORED FRAMED PIECE OF CRAP YOU CALL A WEBSITE? AT LEAST THEN THERE MIGHT BE SOME ACCOUNTABILITY FOR WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

MY E-MAIL ADDRESS IS ARTOGIS@EARTHLINK.NET, AND ANYBODY WHO CARES TO SAY ANYTHING TO ME ABOUT THIS POST CAN FEEL FREE TO DO SO.

I JUST WANT TO CLEAR MY NAME. THE ONLY THING THAT I HAVE EVER POSTED ON THIS SITE WAS A POSITIVE ABOUT THE COMPANY.

JOHN LAUGHLIN

Admin's Response: A half inch...that's all it takes. Had you moved your finger over just a half inch and hit the Caps Lock key, I would have actually read your message. But you didn't, and so I didn't.

From: matt hamsher
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetter

well, i was sittin there watchin the news,lap top fired up...then it happened!!! the phone rang....was a telemarketer
from pacesetter!!!! while listening to his sales pitch...i decided to go online and research the company.well lo n behold !!!! YOUR WEBSITE WAS RIGHT BELOW THERES!!! THANK YOU BOTH VERY MUCH !!!

From: Dawn Gray
E-Mail: Private
Subject: THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!

I had recieved a phone call (at 8:30 p.m.!!!!!), which I did not pick up because of how late it was. I looked on my caller I.D. and did not recognize the company that was calling. I got online to check and see what type of services they were promoting and I seen your site. I was glad to read your experience with Pacesetter and I know what to do if they call me again in the future. I am sorry that you had to go through this bad experience and hope it will work out for you. I will be sure to pass the word on.

From: Michael Cherek
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Holy CRAP

everyone in the omaha company just got laid off i was one of those few, ya it is a good window but definitly a very bad buisness. I got dirt on these guys and I got fellow co-workers to back it up. email me maybe ill settle it in court.

From: Barry Smith
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter is DONE

I understand that the Schragers sold the company to Gary Iskra and he shut downt he factory in Omaha. I got this info from inside sources. I also uderstand that Iskra has moved towards internet marketing and contracting out the products and labor all over the country!!!
WHAT COMES AROUND, GOES AROUNG YOU PACESETTER SCHMUCKS!!!

From: Jason
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Thanks

I had signed up several months ago with Service Magic to get estimates to have my house painted. Service Magic is an internet based service where companies contract with them to receive information from people like me who sign up to have specific work done on their house. It was a great way to get companies to contact me.

Well, as I said this was several months ago. Just last week I get a call from Pace Setters saying they got the number from Service Magic and they want to sell me windows. I told them I just moved into my house and I don't have any money to pay for windows right now. Of course the telemarketer understands this but wants to send someone out to give us an estimate anyway so we will have it on hand when we are ready. I wasn't feeling up to arguing with the guy so I said, "OK". He checked with me to make sure he had the correct address and we agreed that someone would be there the following Monday at 6:00 PM to give the estimate. Because he had my information from Service Magic, he had my old address. When he read it to me I said, "Yes that's right." knowing it wasn't, but I didn't care, I didn't want him sending out a salesman anyway so I let it go.

Since then, I have been getting a call every day and because I have caller ID, and becuase I remember the number was from the 916 area code I thought it was him. I just haven't been answering the phone and of course they aren't leaving a message. I wasn't sure who it was so the next time the 916 number came up I Googled the phone number ((916) 364-3900) and found this site.

Thank you for putting up this site. Next time he calls I'll ask him to stop calling me and I might even appologize for knowingly giving him the wrong address. I'm fully expecting to get into an argument over it, but I don't care. There's no way in H E double hocky sticks that I'm going to let them come to my house and harrass me for five hours.

As for you people, posting to this site, that work for Pace Setters and are complaining that the admin is taking food out of your mouths, it may be true for you, but there's another hardworking honest salesman out there that is receiving more business as a result of this site. You should go work for him.

From: Greg Mendoza
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Thief

I was recently trying to contact Pacesetters for my mother who is a 67 year old lady who was taken advantage of when she had recently done business with them. They had put new cupboards and windows into my mothers home. Now for anyone who is a decent person would understand that we have to protect the rights of our elderly and understand that they are a vulnerable person of our society. Well the company of Pacesetter must not have no dignity or ethics because my mother fell victim to them not only once, but twice. Because of this they have now put a lean on my mothers home and i am in the midst of trying to settle this dispute, but not with much luck. This is wrong and i believe they should be held accountable for the wrongdoing. I know that this is partially her fault also, but it is great to know that there are real stories and individuals who can relate to the mishappening, so to speak. Please send me a reply because i would love to see this company be held liable for their wrong-doings.

Greg M.

From: Linda Surprise
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetters do not stand behind product

Customer Service does not call back.
There windows do get wet on the inside, very wet.
Still did not get the lock latch for window that was broke when windows where dropped off.
And was told by sales man that my cat would not be able to tear the screen, not so
Also have a friend that got them and he is very dissatisfied with the windows.
His windows are also very wet.

From: Joe Earley
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter Story

I can't believe that Sam's Club has hooked up with this company. Trusting that Sam's would not allow a company with a bad reputation in their doors, I agreed to have a "Home Services" representative come and give me a quote for replacement windows and gutter guard. When I spoke to the rep in the store, he said that they could install all types of name brands like Pella or Anderson. It turns out that it is Pacesetter. Upon finding that out, I did some research so I thought I was prepared for what was to come. I was wrong. The quoted time of 45 minutes turned out to be two hours and fifteen minutes. Thankfully the price they quoted me was about four times higher than other ones I had received. It pretty much shut them up. The two reps couldn't have been more unprofessional. The were constantly bickering back and forth about who would do what. One of them excused himself two time so he could go and smoke a cigarette. It was so bad it was almost funny.

From: Former Employee
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter no more

The shragers have sold Pacesetter manufacturing and sales, Gary Iskra heads it now and has totally outsourced all of their products mainly to Republic Windows in Chicago. Pacesetter salemen have started selling Republic products as of March 1st. They are closing the Plant as of June 29th. I had worked there for over 20 years as well as most of the plant employees. We are all out of a job. Just thought you should know that Republic Windows and a couple other companies will be doing the outsourcing of Pacesetter products.

From: Kelly
E-Mail: Private
Subject: some things aren't always true

You know, I am not a fan of Pacesetter, but I must say that if you have a TRUE story to tell then post away. If there are nothing but lies maybe you should take a minute to calm down before posting anything. This is a forum where freedom of speech is excercised however, I don't think that it should be a place to spread lies just because your upset about something. If you have tried all the proper channels and still haven't gotten anywhere then I would say that to protest in any way is your American right. Don't get me wrong, I am not accusing anyone of lying, just that be cautious in what you say as it can lead others to beleive false truths about another person.
Thank you.

Admin's Response: We agree completely. I sincerely hope that nobody is posting false stories here, as that not only does not help anybody, but it also undermines what we are trying to accomplish.

From: Mike
E-Mail: Private
Subject: PaceSetter Corp

First let me say, wow, what a story. You deserve sainthood for being that patient. I was looking through our local newspaper while having lunch. I am always looking for something part-time or maybe something I can do from home as I am on the computer all day long. Anyway, I saw this ad from PaceSetter where the guy was complaining that he would run ads and no one would respond. Since I had never heard of the PaceSetter Corp, I decided to look at their web site. It would not come up for me, so I did a google search and found your site. I decided to read to see what was going on and I am very glad I did. Thanks for saving me a phone call, an interview, and maybe taking a job I would have to leave the first time I ask a boss to call someone back and they didn't do it. There needs to be more sites like yours.

From: T.C.
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter totally and completely sucks!!!!!!

PLEASE don't put real name with this if you post it. thank you

Until April 24 2004 I worked for The Pacesetter Corporation out of Lenexa KS. I was hired on Feb 24 by the production manager at the time Bill Holler. The only condition to being hired was to pass a criminal background check. According to the managment Pacesetter won't hire felons. LIE number one. Bill Holler has a felony for possession and dealing of crack/cocaine. Upon being hired all 14 of the new employees were told they would make 8 to 10 dollars an hour and we were told even employees with mental defects had no problem easily making $300 plus a week in bonus. LIE number two. Training was paid but at the rate of 5.15 an hour and the largest bonus I ever made was $87 after taxes. The majority of new hires didn't even bonus in my 2 months there. These are just minor lies or issues compared to what I would learn later on. Every year Pacesetter sends its top performers in all areas on a tropical vacation. They went to Mexico this year. Only winners of the trip and the spouses are allowed to attend. One victor winner whose sister just so happend to be Kal Dulku's secretary and mistress was allowed to go by tricking higher up management that she was actually her brothers wife so she and Mr. Dulku could be together in Mexico. The entire call floor knew of this because the mistress/secretary returned with "souveniers" of illegal prescription medications, to share w/ coworkers that she obtained while in Mexico. I was also later told by two different managers that the secretary/mistress's brother did not actually win the Victor award but was given it unbeknownst to him, by Kal and his mistress/secretary who handled distribution of leads. When all of this was reported to corporate management nothing was done because Joe Schutte Corporate Manager (the manager set by the corporate office to handle the situation) made out with and "fooled around" with the same girl at a public restuarant while on the mexico trip if front of other pacesetter employees. Eventually the young woman was demoted back to the phones but kept her rate of pay at $14 an hour. At another seperate event the company New Years Eve party held at Mr. Dulku's house the same young woman preformed as a stripper giving topless lap dances to coworkers.
The side of all the pacesetter scandals that relate to me is that the day after Bill Holler left pacesetter he held a party at his house which his girlfriend invited me to. I drank and passed out on his couch, I was woken up during the middle of the night by a nude Mr. Holler touching me in sexual ways, I asked him to stop and moved his hand away but he put it right back and said to be quiet, I said to stop a second time and he shushed me and continued finally he stopped. A week later my performance at work had plummeted and I was barely functioning at work or home. I had not gone to the police because I thought I was responsible because I had been drinking. I finally went to Mr. Dulku because I didn't where else to turn and explained to him what had happened and I felt that is why my production had fallen off. He said that was understandable and encouraged me to file a police report. Just over two weeks later I was fired for low production. When I was hired all new hires were told they would be given six months to become successful employees. I bonused all but one week ( the week of my assualt by Bill Holler)in the 8 weeks I was there. The woman who is Kal Dulku's girlfriend has a low production rate consistantly but never got fired.

I will post more info when I have more time!!!!!!

From: Dagmar
E-Mail: Private
Subject: ZIP file containing all of the stories since April 22

Thank you so much for making this web site.
We had an estimate from Pacessetter Corp. last week. They suppose to show for a second appointment with examples of frenches doors and large size of windows, which they couldn't show us the first appointment. They didn't show up, so I started searching on the web.
BBB would not tell me, how many complaints this company had, because all the complaints were resolved. So there is basically no way of finding out, other than you web page, what are the complaints about.
My husband got Pacesetter Corp. coming in 2 days ago after many phone calls, trying to find out, who was here. They didn't leave any business card the first time. We asked for it this second time. The prices got up this time over $3000 (french doors), so we did not sign any papers.
I would like to get the zipped file, so I could sit down and read all the stories. We are limited to an installation of french doors and some huge size windows, so we need custom sizes, which aren't offered by the Andersen company contractor's. That is our reasoning for Pacesetter Corp.
Thank you in advance
Dagmar from Indiana

From: Former HR Employee
E-Mail: Private
Subject: All true !!!

As a former employee of Pacesetter in the HR dept for 8 yrs, I can verify that most, if not all, of the information on your website is accurate. You would not believe some of the stories I have heard in my "career". Now that Pacesetter has been sold by the Schragers and the "plant" is shutting down, I expect things to become much worse. Beware before doing business with this company.

From: Jessica
E-Mail: Private
Subject: It started out good

I am a former employee of The Pacesetter Corp. As of today I no longer work there. This place has no ethics or morals, and it's quit disturbing. I started working for the company in Janurary of 2004, as a telemarketer. My first day on the job I was given this "pitch" to follow. And thru out the next week and a half I was taught to "side-step till the NEED question" ( so how many windows will you NEED)At first I thought that this was a good place to work. The people seemed okay and the fact that the factory is 42 years old, made me feel comfortable in what I was doing. One day after work one of my bosses came back to the house to have a few drinks with me and my husband, who still works there. He showed me this site. Talk about a shocker. The more I read the worse it got. Well what really made it bad for me was one Saturday at "the office" I went on my normal cigarette break. As I was standing there smoking, another employee jumped into his truck to go get " high " on his break. On his way out the parking lot he yelled something out of his window, at me, that is so volgure I won't repeat it. Luckily another employee was outside at the same time I was, and he heard what this guy said. It was immediately brought to the managers attention. There were 3 managers there that day and one of them got pissed off at me, because it was brought to his attention first and he said he'd take care of it. But I of course told the other managers, because I didn't feel that this particular manager would take care of the situation. He got mad because I believe he wanted to "sweep it under the rug". Well that following Monday, I know that it was brought to the BIG BOSSES attention ( Bill McIntyre).Now understand that the guy who made the comments to me is a 12 year employee.This happened on March 13,2004. Weeks past and Mr McIntrye never approach me about the situation. My production rate began to drop. I was trying to get his attention!!!! I wanted him to talk about this with me. Instead, he approached my husband and said "so is this water under the bridge" and my husbands response was " you need to talk with Jessica about that". Now 6 weeks had passed by and Mr McIntrye had yet to talk with me about it. He hadn't talked to me, not even to say how are you doing, or good morning, nothing. Then Monday April 26,2004 he called me into his office and begun to "let me go". He says he got a complaint from someone I called, this person supposedly said I was rude. I explained to him that I did not, and have never been rude to a potential customer. He said okay he would dispute it. I still had my job. Then he begun to talk about my production rate and said it was not acceptable. So I promised I'd bring it up. He then threatened cut my pay by $.50. And put me on a 30 probation period. That night my husband and I decided that that was enough. We have an 8 month old daugther and I am a full-time student. So this morning I just didn't show up.
As for my experience with Pacesetter it SUCKED!!!!!!!!!!!
I will not ever recommend anyone working there or buy their "Quality Products". This company is a joke and I hope now that Mr Schrager ( the owner of this wonderful company) knows exactly what kind of people he has running his operation.
I'm sure that when the Schrager family started this company in 1962, it was a good company with a great reputation. But now it has turned to shit.
This company brainwashes their employees and doesn't care how many time the customer says theyre not interested. My advice to anyone who keeps getting these annoying call: you have to tell the person who called you to " take you off the calling list" and if they don't you then have a lawsuit you can persue. And if anyone wants to call back and talk with anyone in the telemarketing department call 1-800-444-7702. Not the number that shows on your caller id, no one answers that phone.And for a good reason I'm sure.
In close good luck with getting Pacesetter off you back and don't trust any of them....

From: Wilma & Jack Moore
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Left hanging

We live in Enid, OK, we had just signed up as members at Sam's Club, and right off the bat we no sooner get inside the store we are approached by a young lady that was pregnant, she had such a sad look on her face I felt sorry for her it was during the holiday seasons. I told her I don't like giving out personal information, I was hesitant, but she assured me it was safe, and she got paid by how many people she could get to fill out the information for a salesman to contact us. I was reluctant, but it was Christmas and I was happy because we had just got our Sams card, and maybe something good would come from all of this, also we were at Sam's club thinking it was safe. What happnes next was all downhill, and one of the reasons I don't like a salesman coming to our home is I'm concerned about being ripped off, as soon as the salesman shows up I said we didn't want to hear his sales pitch if he could just get to the windows which is what I signed up for, so much for that hours later... well before I tell my story which I've tried to forget because of the mental anguish it has caused us. We recently went back to Sams in OKC to shop, do you know we were in the middle of an isle shopping, and this girl actually runs up to us, she was huffing and puffing by the time she caught up to us, you know my first thought was oh no here is someone else trying to get us suckered into Pacesetter, sure enough. My husband stopped because he is nicer when it comes to talking I'm more like no thankyou, when I heard she was wanted us to sign up for Pacesetter I was about ready to walk out of the store, I was very upset that we now are being chased down by Pacesetter while shopping in what I thought was a safe enviornment. I'm furious can't even go shopping without being harassed, after what our experience was already with Pacesetter than someone chasing us down in the store I don't feel comfortable shopping any longer at Sams because I feel they should not allow Pacesetter to be harassing customers. We were taken for a ride, idiots as my husband says by Pacesetter, I'm very thankful the only damage that was done was the inconvenience, the rudeness, I have a very long list of complaints about the salesman that rudely insisted upon his sales pitch when I asked him not to that we didn't have the time for a 5 hour speech which is what it turned out to be. This salesman actually forced himself onto us, he wouldn't listen to anything we had to say, he kept telling me not to interupt him. We just wanted an estimate we told him that is what we signed up for was a free estimate, he insisted that he wasn't going to be leave until he made a sell, and that he was in a contest to go to Las Vegas. He called told my husband at noon that he would be at our home by 2:00 he didn't show until around 6:00 p.m., and wouldn't leave until 10:00 p.m. I was really upset I didn't appreaciate this guy walking around our home, going in and out always saying he had to use the phone or measure the windows I mean how many times do they have to measure the windows it was very uncomfortable, I asked him to leave that we were not interested, but he insisted on finishing his sales pitch he just wouldn't leave. I felt like a prisoner in my own home. They keep telling us they want this trip with their wives to go to Las Vegas and they can do this with the help of us all we have to do is buy. It was out of control, this guy gets up to walk around which I thought he was going to measure the windows in the other room, but instead he is looking at our computer equipment, and makes a comment about our electronics, oh now that had me worried between all the times he claimed he was measuring the outside of our windows than why was he going through the inside of the house? He kept saying he had to go out to his vehicle why so many times made no sense, then his friend and himself had to go out together, I told my husband to get them to leave that I didn't want them back in our home. My husband is more patient I was upset I wanted them to just leave, they had changed their story so many times, kept offering us a free storm door only if we did the front windows. They were telling us what windows we would get done, not what windows we wanted done, than it dawned on me as he kept running his mouth that he was only interested in our windows that faced the front of the street so people could see thier work. I'm not one that just gets to the point, I could list the things he said and continued to tell us how badly he wanted this trip to Las Vegas, and on and on. We have a small two bedroom home why he needs to ask us personal questions about other things really got under my skin, so I asked him to please just get on with what it would cost, and he kept going on telling me not to rush him that he wasn't leaving our home until I signed the contract. He noticed I must of had this worried look on my face or something because he brings up Sams he tells us we can trust them because Sams stands behind their work. I guess that was suppose to make us feel more at ease, I had never heard of Pacesetter at first it didn't ring a bell with me, but my husband kept trying to assure me it would be ok that I shouldn't worry it was a trustworthy company been in business for years. We thought we were doing the right thing, but the salesman got upset with me because I changed my mind after he insisted we do the windows he wanted us to do, and I said we wanted other windows done, we signed the paperwork, oh was I sick afterwards, but my husband kept assuring me it would be alright. Well to skip a whole lot we never hear from this salesman again, my husband had to call to find out what was going on, I don't know who he talked to we were left with phone numbers to call, but mysteriously this salesman doesn't work for Pacesetter anymore, and the one that pushed himself on us and was admiring our electronics wasn't available to talk to. I also felt we were being taken advantage of because we are disabled. That burned me up, the next thing we know its weeks later we come home and some guy is measuring the outside of our windows, and that was the last we ever heard or saw of Pacesetter. None of the work was done, we were told it was in house financing so we were guaranteed the job would get done, and I was just getting ready to write a letter to Pacesetter to find out if there was an email address to write to them and find out what is going on? I even wrote a letter to Sams about what happened they never responded to my letter which bothers me. The least I expected was some response from Sams. We would like to know what we can do about this, we were looking forward to getting our windows done, but just replacement for small windows was going to cost us over $2000.00, unreal I couldn't believe the cost, and nothing was told to us about if there would be extra costs for materials. Left Hanging in Enid

From: George Zils
E-Mail: Private
Subject: DO NOT CALL request...Hello?

4/7/04 I just received a telemarketer call from Pacesetter Corp by a person called Roland. He started his slaes pitch, I told him I was not interested and please remove me from your call list. He instantly hung up on me without a word.

I checked the called ID and called them back (916-364-3900).
I got an automated operator and after 6 attempts I was unable to speak to any live person. I am going to write a complaint to the BBB and the Chamber of Commerece in the city they operate in.

From: Sara
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Sympathy

I worked at Pasesetter for about 4 months, and when I use to call people they would tell me that they have already gotten Pasesetter. Their windows would fall out of their walls!!!! I was let go because I wasn't up to speed, so they said. They put about 6 of us in a meeting room and said that we were all fired. They do not treat their emplyoees very well either.

From: Steve Morrison
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetter lying to the largest retailer in the world

Just for your FYI , as an Ex employee paceseter has somehow conned Sams Club into getting into bed with them in a program called HSS. Sams believes Pacesetter is clean and nation wide company and know are down to around 14 offices( far from nation wide) Sams also is being scewed by them several ways and I am sure they do not know. In Indiana\Pacesetter does not even have a liscense or workers comp and I am sure Sams does not know about the financing they kill the customers with.

From: private
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetter previos customers

I worked for pstr for 7 years and it was my career. I loved the business. The biggest problem that I found was the way they service the previous customers. The telemarketers are trained to tell them the factory Rep is going to come out to check the installation. Which never happens. Most of the Reps dont know how to anyway. People get upset with the high pressure sales tactics. (understandably so) The problem is That poor S.O.B. has his ass ripped apart by the sales manager everyday if he (she) doesnt sell. Ive heard them being called every name in the book. They really brainwash these Reps so if for no other reason than to sell out of Pride alone so that they can feel good about themselves. I really doesnt matter how badly the rip off the customer. In fact the more they rip them off the more money they make. The products are not really differnt than anyother that you can buy anywhere else. It is very true that they pick on what they call a lower class of clientel. Anyone with any money is way too smart for this.add, subtract,multiply, divide where the rep trys to break the price down by the warranty period to show you how a 17000.00 deal costs JUST pennies a day. I did it for years but I was really good at hiding the fact. I truly feel like crap for someof the things that I did with that company. And YES I have lost alot of sleep over it. P.S. Pacesetter will not push the products on you as long as you cancel your contract before they install them. Even if the recission period is up. At least ive never heard of them doing it.

From: will
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Beware of these jokers!!!!!!!!!!!

I was approached at Sams-Club about a free quote from Pacesetters Corp. for some home improvements. Well these two yo-yo's show up and WOW! what a dog and pony show my wife and I had to suffer through. It was kind of a good cop/bad cop scene. They went on and on and on and on about how great the company was; ya'da ya'da ya'da Who Cares! We had 3 other quotes for the work we wanted done,but Pacesetters was so inflated it was embarrassing. Then this pitch how they don't play games and offer "one" price because their prices are the most fair in the industry. I knew I was being scammed when I got this price is for "today" only bit. When I asked them to leave it was like watching children not getting there way! I thought for sure they were going to drop to the floor and have a temper tantrum.
STAY AWAY FROM THESE JOKERS!!!!!!!!

From: robert dehaan
E-Mail: Private
Subject: I was an employee

i started at pacesetter in 2001 and was promoted to an assistant managment position in charlotte n.c. my branch telemarketing manager was doin cocaine and drinking hard alchohol in the office the corporate staff you know the big wigs in omaha nebraske came and were doing cocaine with him so i let that slide cause they were paying my bills lee larimore became the new branch telemarketing manager and fired me because of my age so i was transferred to the richmond virginia office there i found that all the reps do is lie in the home do not buy pacesetter floors they are 10* as much as if you were going to get it from home depot well that office got shut down just like charlotte did so Joe Shuetee told me he would payoff my lease and move me and my wife and my two children two tacoma well i arrived in tacoma and they never payed off my lease my credit was ruined so they told me they would sign a lease for me after making my children and wife stay in a hotel for 3 months so they sign the lease everything is good i found out that nichole shleicer was selling crystal meth to telemarketers and the tacoma manager mike chahulski and the best communicators charles moore and rob terrel were smoking weed in the warehouse my general manager threatned to fire me over language so i told him about all im telling you about and he buckled when i called their drug dealer 2 weeks later i was fired they called me and told me and my family i have 3 days to vacate the premises they were payroll deducting rent from my check so i had no $ me and my family had to leave all our belongings behind oh yeah about gary cluck he is a prick he does not care about anyone but himself, anyway after that incident lee larimore called me from st.louis and told me to come there i could work for him i moved all the way there and he told me i was black balled and could never work for the company again so as you can see consumer, employee or what have you pacesetter is the biggest scam on the face of the earth and they will cut your throat any way possible especially customers they lie to you just to get you off the phone

From: Dale and Judy Wingstrom
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Counter clain aginst Pacesetter

We have completed our claim aginst pacesetter and the score is Wingstroms 1 pacesetter 0
The courts ruled that we did not have to go to arbitration and could continue our case in the courts, the wording in there own contract provided this.
We did not get exactly what we wanted but are pleased the courts saw fit to make pacesetter pay for there damages and poor workmanship.
the outcome was they were awarded the full sum of there contract and we expected this to happen, we however were awarded the damage sum equal to the windows and interest for the last 2 years leaving a balance owed to us from pacesetters for $606.00 plu interest.
dont take there threats and intimadating tactics, go for it and take them to court.

From: James Yates
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Oh how I wish I had found your site a year ago.

Long story short:

I am in the Ohio/WV/PA area. I signed up to get some doors and windows replaced. Then a floor.

Final price of all this? 1/6 my house cost. My doors are installed poorly. My floor is horrible. And top it off, it's a lien on my house?

Plus: Floors to be refunded (maybe)
Minus: Doors will not be, and no damages paid.

Please, please let me know what numbers to call. My attorney and I are meeting to discuss what the next step is.

I don't think I'd be so angry if they'd just... call back?

From: Missy Shankle
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Thank you

Thank you for having this website up---I am a professional sales person and was considering going to work for this company. I appreciate your efforts in dealing with consumer fraud---you will save many people from your unfortunate business dealing.

From: Chris Griffin
E-Mail: Private
Subject: I was dumb enough to go to work for this company

I worked for the Wichita office for a very short time. After being sent all over the state of Kansas to arrive at peoples homes that were either so upset with the way the lead office in Kansas City treated them, forcing them to let us in, the homeowners had no interest in purchasing home improvements, however my boss expected us to drive across Kansas to arrive at peoples homes and try and get them to buy something. The sales people in the Wichita office get no compensation for mileage etc, the office feels that 150 dollars is enough compensation for 8 nights lodging out of town, meals and gasoline. Then us salespeople were told that we would receive our commission after the clients signed the contract, then Pacesetter would change it to after installation, on and on. I "spent" so much money working for this company that I used up all my wives and mine savings and sent us completely broke. We in Wichita were never ever trained although we begged for training. The salesmanager in the Wichita office is very deceitful and never tells the truth. I have complained to the regional office in Nebraska, and nothing was done. I heard through the grapevine that they hire four employees to keep just one but it is more like 12 to one. This company has a horrible reputation in Wichita. If I had money I would sue them. I hope someone out there does.

From: Kim
E-Mail: Private
Subject: former employee

I worked for Pacesetter a number of years ago and I must agree with you. Pacesetter preys on the elderly people of our communities, among others. They have many gimmicks they use to get sales, i.e. brining the "wife" when in actuality, its another sales rep. The sales reps are taught not to take no for an answer. They do put liens on property for financed sales and its not a mechanics lien, its an actual Deed of Trust! They also treat their employees very badly. I've seen people get transferred to other cities and states to work at other offices and within two weeks be fired. They wreck peoples lives without a second thought. I've seen the general manager (now a VP) at one office get a $45,000 bonus at the end of the year. The office staff, sales reps, and telemarketers (ya know, the ones that actually work) get nothing. I would never do business with Pacesetter if I they were the only window company left and I had no windows!!! The reason they want to sue is because this is all true and they don't want anybody finding out about how unethical and immoral they are.

From: Gerry
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Takes two to tango

How can you say that you are being overcharged at all on the products that you buy? I would like to see these "Same quality, Same built" Products. Or at least say their names Pacesetter Representative do not make a ton of money and most of them do not sell things to people that do not want or need our products. If you are hearing from an ex-employee then of course they are going to be saying negative thing about Pacesetter, At the last job all of you lost didn't you say bad things about that company? Our company is ran by Humans, The last time I heard, Humans were not a perfect breed. We try to do the best that we can and yet that seems to be not good enough for all of you. I am a Senior Feild Trainer for the company, and I have been with them for some time now and all of my customers are 100% satisfied with the work that has been done on there house. 1.3 million satisfied homwowners are not customers that bought 5-6 years ago they are new customers that are happy with everything. instead of making general statements to include all pacesetter reps I think you should refer to the people you delt with. I in no way sell anything to anyone who does not need it or who does not want it. and as far as the 10 steps go, All consumers should feel privalaged that there are PEOPLE in the world who will take the time to look at your home and see if there is a need. when things are done in a right manner it takes time, if we don't take the time to try to ensure that things are right then why even try?
You at this site are trying to sell people on the fact that Pacesetter is not a good company to deal with yet you can say that salesman are unethical? I don't understand that.

From: jeremy
E-Mail: Private
Subject: thats your case

i guess the old saying is right you treat a customer as good as you can than they will tell 1 person. but if you mess up then they will tell 10 or in your case 1000s. i am a salesman that is how i make my living. i am honest and dont believe in lying to anyone. in any case you pay for the product. i am sorry to what happened to you and your other visitors but you have taken away money from alot of families by doing what you do. you are doing the same thing that a sales man does by INFLUENCING your readers not to use an excelent made product. now i understand that 100% of the customers can not be 100% satisfied 100% of the time...thats nature. but i can promise that we do not practice unethicly. you had a bad experiance i understand that but when you say that we take advantage of people...go look in the mirror. you are too. just reading the responses of the people who have already entered into an agreement to cancell their orders. that doesnt bother you? well you are no better than the company that you are bashing. for those of you reading please take into consideration that we do the best we can do. if it is in the contract than we have to. i am sorry to this bitter person with this website but enough is enough. you are a salesman!

From: jeremy
E-Mail: Private
Subject: thats cool

the best thing about this country is that we do have the freedom to speak out. i am perfectly fine with thiat. i am in sales and i would like to just put a little insight to this. the ten steps program is not deceitfull...it is a standard in sales. if you people out there are so easily influenced it is your own fault not the salesmans. i always want my customers to check out what there buying and you should. that is noones fault but your own. you should read the contract before siging it. thats your fault again. you can not sit there put the blame all on pacesetter for your own mistakes of not properly reading all material. they have over 1.3 million satisfied customers across the nation and are 42 years old...they must be doing something right. as for the sales tatics go buy a new car go buy a house heck go buy anything its all the same. i dont know anyone who will take the time away from there families and there own time to come to someones (a strangers) to try to help with there own home improvements. i have been in the construction buisness for almos 15 years not just in the sales area. and the product that i have seen from pacesetters is by far a superior product. so if you want to bash them thats cool...but remember your the one that signed the contract you should be responsible for your own actions.

Admin's Response: I cannot speak for others, but I can speak on our experience. You say that we're the ones that signed the contract, and we should be responsible for it. Does that hold true for Pacesetter as well? They also signed the contract, and when they did not hold up their end of it, they not only tried to shirk their responsibility, but turned around and tried to make us feel like they did nothing wrong and it was all our fault.

You also make mention that if people are so easily influenced, then that is their own fault. This sounds like you are saying that if someone is very gullible, then they deserve to be taken advantage of. From a salesman's point of view, this would definitely be a benefit, but looking at it from a human perspective, it is very mean. I, personally, would always want to make sure the customer knows exactly what they are getting into. I would not want to sell them something they didn't need, and I would not want to sell it at an elevated price so that I could make a lot of money. So I doubt very much that I would make a very good salesman.

And just because Pacesetter has over 1.3 million satisfied customers across the nation, that does not mean that they must be doing something right. They could have done something right in the past to get those satisfied customers, which is what it sounds like when hearing from the employees who used to work there many years ago. Or those customers might be very satisfied with the work and products, but not realize that they were severely overcharged and/or didn't need the products in the first place. Had everything gone smoothly during our installation, I'm sure we would also have been satisfied customers, never realizing what Pacesetter was truly about. You are really able to tell a lot about a company when you get to see how they handle the mistakes that they make.

From: Gary
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Really

Stupid you all need to tell the whole story I would imagine you are leaving out some details that you all did in between all these events Pacesetter treated me right and does a VERY WONDERFUL JOB!!!!!!!!!!

Admin's Response: We did tell our entire story. I'm glad Pacesetter treated you well, but that doesn't mean we are lying about how we were treated. And there is no need for name calling, as it helps no one.

From: Vickers
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter Flooring

We were contacted by Pacesetters in early December of 2003.
They sent 2 salesmen out the same night. The first salesman
said that he was in training.(He was much more likeable than
the second man)It took the other salesman over an hour to get there. These men were in our home until after 11pm.
The second salesman told us that a sub floor would be put
down, then a foam padding, then the actual flooring. The first price we were quoted was around $3,800.00. I'm sure
you could imagine the look on our faces! Finally we came to
an agreement on a CASH price. We did not hear a word from
Pacesetters until Dec.23,2003. Who in their right mind is
going to have their house all torn up during the holidays?
They finally got ahold of us after Christmas to install.
My husband came home after the installer had the floor started. He asked the installer where is the underlay? The
installer said that we did not need one. So my husband told
him to stop working until we could get this straightened out. A call was placed to the second salesman. He argued with my husband and things got heated, the salesman hung up
on him. A second call was placed to the salesmans supervisor. In the meantime the installer asks my husband if
he want's him to go get the plywood? My husband got on the
internet to find out how much it would cost us to purchase
just the materials. We wanted a price reduction since a sub
floor was not needed. Finally my husband told the Boss what
we would pay for the job to be completed and that if that
was not acceptable they (Pacesetters) could get their stuff
out of our house. They decided to accept our offer. I wrote
on my check paid in full and asked the installer to give me
a receipt saying PAID IN FULL. He did this on my copy only.
Since the floor was installed Pacesetters has made 2 appointments to come see if the floor was installed properly. No show either time. The salesman also told us how
durable the flooring was. It would not stain, scratch,warp
and so on. The installer said to use very little water to clean the floor. DA why would you put a floor in the kitchen
that can't get wet?
We are still waiting for the fall out.
They really BRAG on their reputation for the Better Business
Bureau. I think we should all flood the BBB with our complaints.
The only thing I have good to say is the installer was great! Thanks Kevin.

From: Mary Calloway
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetter committing fraud and duping the unwary

I am stuck in the middle of a mess. In April a Pacesetter rep came out to my house to see if I would be interested in them doing remodel on my house. They have done storm windows, doors screen doors and a French door in the past. After doing the inspection I was told the that the house would be coated with a special vinyl paint which would never need painting again. However I was advised that I had a lot of rotton wood. To replace the facade and redo would increase my cost to$5500. But for 15000 They would remove all rotten and damaged wood and make repairs. I was not on the primises when the workman came and only knew the color was not what was ordered. I called and ask that all work cease until I had spoken to the salesman. He never called but the workers returned in a few days and asked if they could finish the work. My renter said the color did not look so bad so I told them to go ahead. I came to inspect the work on June 15 and found that none of the damaged wood had been replaced. It was not even sanded . No repairs had been done. I immediately started writing and calling Pacesetter and Federal Diversified. In August the new area manager came out and said he would get a technician out. I never heard from him again. After more calls and letters a represenitive came out with a contractor and said they could do a little patching here and there. I became angry at that point and said theat I could no longer trust this company. They had charged me for work which was not done. I wantwed them to ammend the contract and charge me only for work done. I put this in writing and gave it to the represenitive. The long and short of it is I stopped paying and Federal Diversified has been calling me every day. I have wrtten a letter to Gary Ishi the vice president with no response. I have called and left messages with no response. I have filed a complaint with the attourney general and State licensing with no response. On yesterday a Federal Diversified represenitive called me at 7 A.M. and said I would have to pay. They have a lein on the property and intend to collect. I told her of my experiance and she suggested that I get a lawyer because they will not negeotiate. Now how is that for a nightmare. Even though I do not believe in going to court, here I am.

From: Roger
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter

Wow this is an eye opener. I did not know that this was a Maulti Level Marketing company. I really hate MLM's.

I think that this web site really gave me an insite to Pacesetter. We want to have siding on our home and I will use the 10 stepes against the sailes rep. Such as going right on to the measuring and pricing. I really thank you for the information. :-)

From: Steve
E-Mail: Private
Subject: windows

Im a woodworker by trade, and quite busy, Im concidering having 6 windows in my cabin replaced by pacesetter.Since
I do understand large companies do somtimes experience problems and its how they take care of these issues that seperate the good from the bad. I was wondering If the 100% money back garanty applied for you. The sale rep told me that if for any reason if they could'nt complete the job to our satisfaction we had 30 days to complain, from this time foreward they had 120 day to rectify the problem or, we'ed get our mony back and the windows were free. after all you went through were your products givven at no charge?????
Thank you for your time .... Steve

Admin's Response: I feel the same way, that it's not the problem but how the problem is dealt with. We didn't know about any 100% money back guaranty. After a long fight, we were finally refunded money for our garage door which was never installed, but that's it.

Ken Innes IV (primehalo@hotmail.com)
http://www.AbsoluteAnime.com/
http://www.PacesetterSucks.com/

From: Marlin
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Windows apparently are not for the Northern Climate

Since I have gotten Pacesetter windows I have nothing but problems. I have to put paper towels in the channels of the windows to keep the wind from coming in. About two to three years ago I called and said that the wind was moving the curtains and a big draft was coming in. They sent a "Tech" out to look at the windows. He did an inspection...and said he would report it to the company. He, or the company got back to me !!! In the meantime, I'm not saving any money and I'm actually using more therms of natural gas every year since!! This past summer one of the representatives called me and I told her what was going on and she said that she would take care of it. Well!! She came by and was sending out someone to repair them. A repairman came out and put little styrofoam pieces into the channels but, Guess what!!! It did not make any difference!!
I wanted them to put in storm windows to replace the screens but nothing has been done. Needless to say I will not buy anything from Pacesetter again and I need to let people know how bad the windows are!!! I now will put plastic on the windows...(just like the old ones)..to keep the drafts down....Kind of pathetic...kind of sucks!

From: Micheal Warwick
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Ten Steps to a Sale: a must read!!!!

I have worked for the Pacesetter Corporation for over five years and I would like to inform you of their ten steps to a sale program.

The first step is called the entry. This is simply getting into the house.
The second step is called the warm-up. For 30 minutes or longer "as long as necessary to build trust and confidence" the sales rep is trained to talk about anything other than product. This step is designed to put the customer at ease and not view the salesperson as a salesperson, but as a friend. Most people will warm right up if you pretend to take an interest in things in their home and mirror their values.
The third step is the company. In this step the sales rep spends about 15-20 minutes going through his Pitchbook and describes all aspects of the Pacesetter Corporation. At this point in the presentation the sales rep has been in your home for about an hour and has not even shown you the product yet.
The fourth step is called customer needs. In this step it is the job of the rep to make the customer feel like something needs to be done soon in order to fix any problems they may have. Usually the rep will walk around the house with the customer and point out any imperfections they see in current products and make suggestions. The goal of this step is to create pain and also create urgency so that the customer will buy today.
The fifth step is the product demonstration. In this step it is the job of the sales rep to make the product look as if it is the best in the world...even though there are much better windows on the market.
The sixth step is what is called the pre-close. In this step the rep will say, usually verbatim, "It is really not a matter of whether you folks are going to do the work, but more like when. It is my job as a factory representative to keep a constant flow of orders coming in...blah blah blah. So if I can do three things for you, if I can show you a price that will make you smile, If I can show you a payment if need be, that fits easily into your budget and If I can show you a tremendous savings, is there any reason why we couldn't get together on an installation while I am out here this evening". This step is designed to get a comittment out of the customer to lock them into buying today and also to get any objections the customer may have out on the table.
The seventh step is measure and price.
The eighth step is to explain the price, contract and terms to the customer.
the ninth step is the close. In this step the sales rep will show you a rediculously high price and stay at that price for a while. The high price is designed to shock the customer and make the discounted price which will soon follow look more attractive. The sales rep is taught to exhaust all options before leaving the home.
Step ten is the warm down. This step is designed to comfort the customer, "assuming a sale was made" and make them feel that they made the right decision. The sales rep wants to leave on a good note so that the customer does not have buyers remorse and cancel.
So don't feel special if the rep is in your home for 3-4 hours and has taken what is percieved to be a genuine interest in you, your home, any hobbies or interests etc. you may have. The sales rep is only following the program and you can rest assured that at the next home he will be saying whatever they want to hear, not to mention the fact that he/she will laugh at you and your family in the car on the ride over.

From: Bob Knupp
E-Mail: Private
Subject: liens

I have noticed that a question comes up about the lien on the property. I used to sell for them and I was told to reassure the customer that it was just a mechnics lien and that if they ever sold the house Pacesetter would be paid. I was also told to say that it wasn't a lien on the property. When I read the fine print on the contract I learned differently. That is one of many reasons I left the company. They are not only decietful with customers but with employees as well.

From: lloyd young
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetters problem

sorry we did not find your website sooner. we had windows replaced by pacesetter and have had nothing but a nightmare since. installer broke windows,personal items, while installing .workmanship was terrible. structual damage was done to house in one room.installer told wife not to worry co. would take care of everything under service. this has been approx. 3 months and several phonecalls. first calls being nice and being promised the work would be done. calls got nastier and was told there was nothing they did wrong and that we were just trying to get out paying. have contacted B.B.B. and am now waiting to hear something. seems pacesetters response to similar problems are handled very much the same

From: Bertha Jones
E-Mail: Private
Subject:

Hello-
My name is Bertha and I am an 71 year old widow. My grandchildren just introduced me to this computer machine and I found this imformative web while reporting them to authorities. Oh how I wish I would have had this in the past. Let me tell you about Pacesetter Corporation.

I was first phoned by Pacesetter Corporation in the 1992 for windows. After a long presentation two men pressured me into buying and I have had nothing but harassment ever since. They keep coming back to sell me more junk that I just dont need, but I cant say NO! I think they take advantage of senior citizens. They are so high pressure and rude.
Once my grandson happened to be here when they called and Pacesetter Corporation hung up the phone when he got on the line!!! They will not fix anything, just try to sell me more junk! I have called BBB and the local police, but no one can do anything. The windows are leaking and I get air-draftsand look terrible. Two of them do not open! My grandson can't even open them! The siding has fallen off and I had to hire a church member to fix for a much better price than Pacesetter!!!
This company is a bunch of crooks and don't get involved with them!

From: Julie
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Thanks 4 your detailed story

I really wish more people were as detailed and articulate when then are getting the shaft from a corp. company. I know it was a nightmare for you to deal with them, but you just saved me from dealing with them! Thank you!

From: C.P.
E-Mail: Private
Subject: About the website

I got on the internet to look up Pacesetter Corp. and of course seeing the pacesettersucks web page diverted my attention there. I can see why Pacesetter is upset about the name being used. I am an employee of this company and I can assure you that our products are the very best. I for one would not like the fact that you are in some way causing us to lose potential customers.
Have a heart and think of all the employees at this company who depend on sales to keep us working.

Admin's Response: Yeah, you're right. I mean, just because Pacesetter overcharges, deceives, delays, doesn't return phone calls, doesn't clean up their messes, doesn't respond to service requests, says bad things about their customers, and tries to crush all of our first amendment rights with the threat of an expensive unjustified lawsuit, that's no reason to warn others. We should be a good little boy and girl, and keep our mouths shut so you can get paid. Besides, I'm sure they've must have changed their ways by now....oh wait, they haven't! Read all about our latest experience with trying to get them to honor their warranty (on the Our Nightmare page). We even had to file a complaint with the BBB just so they would contact us.

Oh, and we do really like the rear sliding glass door and the horizontally opening windows, but hate the ones that open vertically. Even with the lubrication that the service guy put on, they are still very difficult to open and close. We also don't like the hydraulic closer on the storm door. Even with the new one that was just put on, the spring will often get stuck so the door won't remain open when you want it to. We've also noticed that those little plastic things at the bottom of the windows that let the moister drain tend to warp and fall out. So that's our very brief review of the Pacesetter products we had installed.

From: drewgoddard
E-Mail: Private
Subject:

you put rubbish in a bin.

Admin's Response: Wow, six whole words. Hey everybody, you better listen to this one!

From: Nancy Welch
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Preying on the elderly

In 2001,right after I was released from the hospital for a terrible fall, the people at Pacesetter targeted me for their high pressure sales tactics. I believe that they researched how much equity I had in my house, then began pressuring me to buy outrageously priced windows, financed at eqully outrageous financing rates. I was on very strong painkillers and just wanted them to leave me alone.I was also not familiar with window prices. My daughter told me she had 14 windows replaced in a more expensive home for $1,800. My house was worth $69,000 at the time, and they sold me 7 windows for $7000.
I have since paid about half of the ridiculous bill, but can no longer afford to pay such a huge payment every month. If they foreclose on my house I will be left with nothing.
How can these people get away with targeting the elderly or sick, who cannot afford these unfair prices?
I am going to complain to the state attorney general, and if that fails, have my daughter who is a lawyer sue them.

From: Ex-Sales Employee
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Some of my experiances with Pacetter's dirty tactics.

Wow! I discovered this website and reading the postings sure brought back some disturbing memories from when I had the displeasure of working there. Thererr
r is so much I could tell you, but I will try and be brief. First of all it is hard to do as much business as Pacetter and not have a few happy customers. Also, Pacetter is fully aware of this site and I would be surprised if they didn't have some current employess trying to post to defend their 'honor'. This is a website of dissent and if Pacetter employess want to post nice things they should put it on Pacetters website. This will be found right above PacesetterSucks.com in Google.com

When I started, Pacesetter said they look for 'streetsmart' young people that they could 'mold'. At the time I didn't know what this meant but I was sure to find out. I remember the daily sales meetings in the morning be scrutinized why you didn't sell your previous days leads. They would joke about how they gave you a "Glen Gary" lead and you weren't doing your job if you didn't sell them. It is hysterical that an employee put a posting saying Pacesetter was not a GlenGary GlennRoss type place. What a bunch of BULL. Pacesetter is where I learned what this term meant. This organization loves their sneaky roaming sales venue. I will bet 80% of my calls were to seniors primarily in very low income areas. Pacetter does not care if you can afford your windows like other lenders might. All they care about is that you own your home in good standing. Pacetter claims they take a lien on customers homes is a perfectly legal step, the problem is many of their customers don't even know they put a lien on their house! The salesman have sneaky ways of doing this so the customer is misled.

I remember making calls with the asst. sales manager or the sales manager. Talk about pressure, when two salesman are sitting in your home for hours on end using the invinsible ten steps. I think some customers sign the paperwork just to get them the hell out of their house.

The bullish telemarketing department is also a sham. We would go to some of these 'leads' and the homeowner would tell you not to call again, quit bothering him and slam the door in your face.

When I quit I had the 'Profit Center' manager asking repeatedly if I had a black or red balance. It seems like he could have just checked himself. I did indeed have a 'positive' balance. A couple or three weeks after I quit I started getting phone calls and bills from Pacesetter. Apparently one of my customers called to cancel their order for storm windows in the $$$ five figure range $$$. I am not sure why the cusomer cancled but Pacesetter definatly wanted my pay back. They even had other sales reps call me. I think I told them to come and try to get it! Eventually the harrassment stopped and Pacesetter became part of my past forever.

P.S. Pacesetter says putting leins on peoples houses are a common business practice. How many people do you know who would have a lein on their house for simple storm windows anyway?

From: Mark T. Phelps
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Fired for religious discrimination

Hello, my name is Mark and I recently got hired by Pacesetters as a greeter here in the Houston area. I told Daniel, the person who hired me that I was a Seventh Day Adventist and did not work from Friday sundown until Saturday sundown. He said that was fine. Well I went to the first day of training Friday at 11:00am for 3 and 1/2 hours and then was told to come back Saturday at the same time for the hand held computer part of the training. I reminded Daniel that I could not come that day. He said I would have to work out other arrangments to be trained. Well I left several phone messages to him for a different day to be trained and never heard back. Eventually I got my training check in the mail. I then physically went to there office site to inquire on why I haven't been contacted back. I was given the Manager's name Aaron, the one who help train us to call. He said I was fired for not contacting them and not showing up on Saturday! Pacesetters should not only be sued, but put out of business. I wouldn't buy anything from them or work for them if it was the last product or employeer on earth! Mark.

From: ed kane
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Garage door that quit working

Pacesetter no longer has a number in the phone book! I have had this new Garage door less than a year .... and it wii no longer open.... Do you know of any phone number in MINNESOTA or an 800 number for PACESETTER CORP??????????????

Admin's Response: Pacesetter's national customer service number is 1-800-999-2790 (according to their website). An ex-employee also suggests a direct number to the corporate office: 1-800-789-HOME (1-800-789-4663).

From: Martin Cantu
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Pacesetter

We thought we were the only ones haveing problumes with pacesetter, God bless you for putting up this website.

My story is just as bad or maybe perhaps worse then yours. Because of pacesetter my pick up truck was repossesed.

call me.
Martin
510 ***-****

From: Patrick Scoggins
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Great Product, Terrible Management

I worked for Pacesetter from 2-02 through 3-03 at the "Dallas" office(located in Arlington.) At first, I was never more excited and enthusiastic to be working for such a great company. The history of Phill Schrager, Pacesetter, and the quality products(which they truly are) made me proud to be part of this team.

I became successful quickly, being the only one in my training class after 1 and half months to still be with Pacesetter! I believe my own success blinded me to what was going on. As long as I was selling, there were no problems at all. Pacesetter even flew about 40+ other reps and myself up to Omaha in August of 2002 to commend us on our sales. It was called the "Nifty Fifty." It was not much longer thereafter, when I began to put the pieces together in the "Dallas" office. For example, in only seven months I had been through FOUR(4) managers, TWO ass. managers and countless sales reps. I never though much of it, being in sales and all. The excuse that Jack Harris (GM) told me was that it was a transition time and they were trying to find the right manager. I later found out that the Dallas office had been changing managers frequently for the past several years. Why? I began to notice problems with some installations, only to see my manager (of the month)lying to the customers.

Some jobs didn't get done at all, only to be canceled by the frustrated customer, because the job was "too small" and not "profitable enough." Some of the reps who were not selling would be yelled at for being "weak" and not closing the deal. Managers would blatantly lie to customers, reps, even their own managers. It would get pretty ugly at times. I understand that sales can be a tough business, but I look back at thing that went on in that office and it was completely inexcusable. I believe my freshness to the sales industry caused me to be naive. Oh, but I learned.

It wasn't until November 2002, when I walked into the office to find yet, another manager named Mike Hill. This guy was as low as you could get, a weasel, a manipulator, a flat out liar! I went with multiple appointments with Mike Hill, and he did countless things such lie to the customer about interest rates, forge documents, ask me to lie to the "new" reps about sales numbers, facts, past experiences (since I was second tenured rep in the office in 10 months!!!) and Lord know what else. On one particular occasion Mike Hill flat out lied to the customer while we were signing the contracts about how the interest rates worked. When I corrected him, he later "wrote me up" the next day at the office for jeopardizing the deal.

I had enough.

It was a very long and strenuous last couple of months with Pacesetter, but I managed to get through it until I found new employment. I tried to discuss the problems w/ Jack Harris(GM) and he just blew me off, saying that Mike was one of his best managers. The problem with Pacesetter is NOT the product, it is very simply the management. Thats when I knew there was no hope.

I began looking for new work and discovered even though Pacesetter does have great products, other companies do as well. I am now with a LARGE company with the highest standards. I will not say the name because I do not want to use it in the same document with Pacesetter. I will say we have been around since the 1880's and are widely diverse in retail, home services, tools, auto, etc. I no longer have to worry about manipulative managers and general managers.

For those of you who are thinking of home improvements, go with someone you KNOW and TRUST. It is the only way in this business.
ps

From: Geoff Sandoval
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Solution

I came across your site and being in the window replacement and siding business I have to same, although I feel for the victims of Pacesetter Corporation, I did laugh. This company has been taking advantage of people for years, with their over priced, inferior products.

I also noticed there are a few other companies in the industry that are a carbon copy of Pacesetter, K-Designers and Sears to name a few.

I have a honest company that specializes in replacement windows and vinyl siding. I would like to offer my services to any one that may have had a issues with Pacesetter. Please pass this on to anyone interested.

geoffsandoval@aol.com

From: jennifer bates
E-Mail: Private
Subject: pacesetter corporation

they are calling me in Klamath Falls Oregon during dinner hours. Telephone soliciting. I said, "No!". It was November 18,2003 @ 5:52 p.m.

Admin's Response: Make sure your phone number is registered in the National Do Not Call Registry (https://www.donotcall.gov/). If it is, then you should file a complaint.

From: donna bower
E-Mail: Private
Subject: The worst decision ever made

In 1993 my husband and I made the biggest mistake we have ever made. Getting involved with the Pacesetter Corportation. In the beginning,granted,it was our fault for signing the financial declaration statement. Yes it was our fault for being swindled into paying $116.94 a month for the next48 months. That $5,550 bought us three windows and a broken screen door. We faithfully paid every month until our last $500.00 payment in the spring of 1997. In the spring of 1999 we received a letter saying there was a lien on our house due to nonpayment to the Pacesetter Corporation. After many nasty phone calls to the most rudest, so called professional team,of the most evil group of people I have ever had to deal with, we received a Full Reconveyance letter saying Pacesetter released the estate and all the property back to us,the trustor. I wish I could tell you that was the end of the nightmare. The end of the midnight phone calls. The end of the threats that they made to us. The end of the profanity, name calling,harrassing phone calls every single day for months. Three months ago we got a letter from the Pacesetter Corporation saying we owed them $1622.27. Payment amount $116.94. DUE DATE: 06/11/97. No my friend, the nightmare and the battle have just begun!!!!

From: Greg Scheel
E-Mail: Private
Subject: ??????????????????????????

Pacesetter is a great company, They have done a great job... They back up there warranties....Everyone is very polite...and helpful.. Dont let this... Loser that has this site tell you different....nothing he says has made sense, my neighbor has been a pacesetter customer for 9 years.... Its a shame,, these people need to find a hobby or get a job.....

Admin's Response: Whether you believe it or not, everything I have stated on my site is true. And please don't start name-calling, as it does not serve any useful purpose.

From: AShanti Abdullah
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Me tooo

I used to work for Pacesetter for a total of 3 or 4 days. When hired I was hired to be the asst.general manager, the only problem is that I did not do that job. They sent me all over town to many different stores to fill in for lead generators. When I asked Rick Allison(General MAnager) about this he assured me that I would start my job in a few weeks. The only problem is that I was not to tell anyone about my position. I left the company, faxed in my time sheets and sent an e-mail and a call to Rick letting him know that I was done and to send my check. It has been 2 weeks and no money. I would love to find out who your attn is and see if they might be able to help my out.


Thanks,
Ashanti

From: angela
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Thank you

Thanks for your informative web-site. I was looking on-line to try to fins a website for Pacesetter Corp. because I was going to recommend the company to my sister. We had two gentlemen (the first one brought his wife with him) come over and give us the schpiel. We wanted to look at the "permanent paint" product they are marketing. We decided that we were not ready to spend that kind of money on a paint job or special permanent coating. The second gentleman was quite happy when we mentioned we would be replacing windows soon. He gave us the hard-sell, but we initially said no. We asked him to call us back later on in the week, but he never called back. Thank goodness!!! We would have signed a contract and possibly be going through the same nightmare that you still seem to be experiencing. Anyhow, the guy seemed nice enough and the guilt part went pretty deep with me and I decided maybe my sister could benfit from their services. NOT!!! I'll be sure to let her know who NOT to work with. Thanks again for the help. Keep up the good work!

From: Rich Rode
E-Mail: Private
Subject: former employee

Wow, Stumbled upon this site looking for my update on my retirement from Pacesetter. I am shocked, (first time typer). I spent 5 years at PPI, Then quit, and returned for another 4 years. I was terminated the second time, and honestly cant tell you why, other than a conflict with my g.m.
So, after reading all "the stories", and emails from other employees, I will give my prospective.
I kept my retirement account with 30K approx., with PPI, because i trust them. And even though its a little less on dividends, it has been the only safe investment over the last 8 years. My enron stock is down to 4 cents a share. What I learned at PPI, i have used in every day life. And owe my success to Dad, PPI, and god. I own a construction company in Texas, not as big as PPI, but give me time.
Complaining about a contract that you signed?, Shame on you people, complaining about the pressure on fixing your home?You same lugs pay $35,000.00 for a s.u.v, thats worth 5k in 4 years. But thats another story.
Reputation? I swear, as a long time employee (past), every complaint is put into the system, and answered, or repaired or the installation manager bonus,and job was in jeopardy.Im not stupid there are exceptions to all rules, but that is not PPI's weakness. In fact they are top rate. Period. As for the Sales tactics, and telemarketing, suck it up, they are direct. What about atletes on t.v, they are worth $25m a year????. PPI takes all walks of life, and offers a opportunity, they employ americans, and they use american products. Im all for free speech, but this is a good company, who is getting slammed. Do I have bad times, and stories? yep. Do I have good times, yep. But not holding people accountable for what they sign and /or agree to, is what is wrong with this country today. And my last comment, that sales rep was working to feed his family and make a living, that telemarketer was working to get a lead, damn right he is good. The installers, and managers, and admin depts are working for one goal....support thier family. And for those of you with legitimate problems and complaints, Call the company, I guarantee you will have their undivided attention,i say give em a chance in writing, if it dont work, then go thru court. period.....and for you others, How proud you are when you say you cancelled, or refused to pay, or want to sue because of what your mom signed. suck it up p-sucker haters, you are too embarrassed to admit your weak, and you wasted alot of time ,gas, and labor, just cause you cant say "NO". pubish my name and e-mail address, I like the company.

From: Rochelle Day
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Researching companies

I spent the evening researching companies on the internet. I recently graduated from a university and interested in a sales position. But I wanted to work for a reputable company.

We, like you have had contractor problems in the past. So I know your pain. I just wanted to say thank you for your website. I would never want to work for a dishonest company.

Best regards in your continued fight. And thanks again for steering me in the right direction.

From: Bob
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Get a life

I am a new associate at the Pacesetter Corporation and was checking on the web to find ouot more about the company and of course found your site. The company is a fantastic place to work so far and I to have heard the "stories" that are refered top here on this site. It is amazing to me that people like you have nothing better to do with their personal time than to create and maintain sites like this. Almost any major companies such as IBM, AT&T, Microsoft, even DISNEY WORLD is plagued by sick people like the person that hosts this site.

Three words ... GET A LIFE!

Admin's Response: You say "people like me"? What does that mean, exactly? People who spend their time and money trying to help others?

And what do you mean by me having "nothing better to do"? There are plenty of other things I would rather be spending my time and money on than a website dedicated to a company I dislike. I don't do it because it's fun, I don't do it to get money, I don't do it to get free product, and I don't it for revenge. I do it because people interested in doing business with Pacesetter Corp. have a right to know more about the company than what Pacesetter tells them. They have a right to know not just of the good stories and recommendations that Pacesetter provides, but of the times Pacesetter royally messes up and how Pacesetter deals with it.

I don't know why the people created websites against any of the companies you mentioned, but personally calling us all "sick people" is a complete generalization and has no basis in an actual, legitimate complaint.

I was hoping that my website would help make some positive changes at Pacesetter Corp, but instead they just decided to crush all of our First Amendment rights by threatening a completely unjustified lawsuit. Now THAT is SICK.

So how long have you been working at Pacesetter Corp? You said you were new, so I would be interested to hear how you feel about the company a year from now. Write back then, okay?

From: K.N.
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Caught in the crap......... I mean Trap

November of 2002, a Clean Cut salesman came to our house and promised us the world. Complete removal of our old 14yr aluminium windows and replaced with pacesetter "CUSTOM" windows. All of this done by a professional instalation crew "hand picked by Pacesetter".
While the windows are nice looking, the construction is less than outstanding. Seals are loose, Fiberglass is cracked.
So the big day came for the "professional crew" to arrive and on my doorstep stands someone that looks like he just got kicked of of the carnival ride operator bus. Smoking as he introduced himself.
He started working and I went about my day as to not get in his way.
I should have known it was bad after he was done with 6 windows in 3 hours.
The most horrible work I have ever seen. The windows were all to small for the correct opening so the installer just placed them inside the holes and filled the gaps with caulk.
The outside was even worse. Most of the siding around the windows is broken and the amount of caulk used to seal up the gaps is totally ugly.
At this point I am in the process of removing the old windows and installing my own.
Pacesetter is to come when I am finished and pick up their windows. They didn't even offer to fix the mistakes. They only offered to re-install windows in the same crappy fashion.
Buyer be ware.
More info and pictures are available if you are having thoughts of buying from this company.

From: Maureen Robison
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Patio Cover has leaked at doorway since day 1

How many Pacesetter employees does it take to repair a leaky roof? The world may never know, because I've had at least 6 repairmen out in 6 years and it still leaks!! They claim to have an office in Redding, but they DON'T. If you call their 800# and go on hold, they claim to have the "best warrantee in the business." LIES. They promise, promise, then they send out subcontractors from out of the area who want nothing more than to get off my property and get out to the lake for a day of fishing! My patio roof leaks to the point that I could NEVER consider enclosing it into a room. I am now considering litigation and I will contact the CA Contractor's Licensing Board ASAP. I have NEVER paid their $45 - $60 fee that they want to charge for warrantee work (THE NERVE). If you like leaky patio covers, call Pacesetter. They won't let you down!! I called them for service on July 27, again in August and I was promised that 'someone' would schedule a service call with me 'soon'. Today is September 25 and I still haven't heard from them.

From: Holly
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Thank you for the info

I was short on time so only read the summary, but that was enough. When they make their confirmation call on Friday I will cancel our Saturday appointment, and save ourselves all the hassle you had to go through.

Thanks again for the warning.

Holly

From: Josh Yambor
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Phil Schrager, great man?

Hello there,
The reason for my email is not to discuss home improvement or bad mouth the Pacesetter Corporation, in actuality I do not even own a home. My reason is to talk about how great Philip Schrager, owner of the Pacesetter Corporation, is really not all that he is cracked up to be.
When I was a senior in high school I applied for his scholarship that he offered at the University of Nebraska at Omaha, and I was fortunate enough to receive it. Now there were several stipulations that accompanied the scholarship, such as maintaining a high GPA, campus involvement and volunteering at an inner city after school program. After I had lived up to all of these criteria, Schrager pulled all of the scholarships leaving those students "high and dry". I was a junior at the time and had no other scholarships to fall back on.
My main argument is that why would this guy pull our scholarships? Was it his financial situation? NO! Was it because we didn't live up to the standards set for us? NO! Was it because he was getting tired of helping out students who were seeking a higher education? Whatever the reason was, I never got it. He had my advisor tell me that it was being unfairly taken away.
That year there was a dinner held at the Chancellor's house for several scholar winners. The Schrager scholars were one of the groups who were invited. The reason for the dinner was for the donors and students to get together and meet eachother. Several hours into the event, after dinner had already been served and eaten, Schrager finally showed, pulling into the driveway in his brand stylish Porsche. This was weeks after I found out that my scholarship was not being offered to me my final year.
I am not saying Schrager is a bad guy, or he should be casted as an evil man. What I am saying is that we had a contract you could say, and in that contract were obligations. Those obligations were never fulfilled and I think that it is unfair and down right pathetic that he acted in this way. Hey if he wanted to end the scholarship, fine, but don't leave students who have worked hard and depended on that money out in the cold.
Shame on you Philip Schrager. You are not that high and mighty and I hope that I never see you or hear your name spoken of again. Sincerely, a frustrated student!

From: Donna
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Worked or Pacesetter

As a former employee of Pacesetter, I can personally vouch for several dissatisfied customers.

Sales technique is to get the customer to buy the first6 night.
If they do not buy the first night, then, the heavy hitters come in and offer another even better discount.
This is to make the first sales rep look incompetent.

Pacesetters hires inexperienced people to go out and talk to people, then they have the boys club, which are the ones that pounce on the no sales, and go for the commissions.

I also observed the fact that the seniors will take the trainees out on leads, make no sale, then return alone and make the sale, collecting 100% commission.

Therefore, most new hires do not stick around, due to no income.

Their incentives are very good, if you are able to collect them. I was conned into entering a pool, then terminated before the completion, and my money will not be returned.

Disgruntled, yes, I made several sales, with lots of commissions, never to be paid, then terminated unjustly.

What is the outcome, I am broke, without a job, and no income coming in to pay my overdue bills.

From: Ken Innes
E-Mail: Private
Subject: Testing the new guestbook

Well, I finally figured I'd give this guestbook thing a try. The one I decided on was Dreambook, from New Dream Network (http://www.newdream.net/). It's very customizable, and seems pretty cool.